| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? 23:25 - Aug 20 with 6001 views | DecageBruce |
I like the deal, think the kid has real potential but the fee agreed (if/when when we stay up) would be another record.
What I do like though, from the BBC report is ‘ The Premier League newcomers have included a clause that would see them sign the 22-year-old on a permanent basis for £30m should they avoid relegation.
A transfer would also be contigent on Ipswich agreeing a contract with Broja at the end of the season.’
I may be being very simple minded but, should we stay up and he’s not for us, can we offer him tuppence a week and if he doesn’t agree then we get out of the £30 million agreed clause.
Extreme example I know but seems (if true) that we may have the option on £30 mill should we think it’s worth it but not committed to match/pay his reported £100k+ wages moving forward |  | | |  |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 23:57 - Aug 20 with 5019 views | quad |
According to a previous article there was speculation from an Italian journalist that we would pay a 30m transfer fee if we avoided relegation.
I'm usually wrong, but I don't believe for a second that Ashton would agree to that, this just seems like lazy journalism from the BBC reporter copying what has been rumoured. |  | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 00:46 - Aug 21 with 4833 views | itfctilidie |
In reality, if we stay up, you would expect Broja would have scored a fair few goals/contributed meaning by that time 30 mill could seem like a bargain |  | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 01:44 - Aug 21 with 4719 views | Vegtablue |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 23:57 - Aug 20 by quad |
According to a previous article there was speculation from an Italian journalist that we would pay a 30m transfer fee if we avoided relegation.
I'm usually wrong, but I don't believe for a second that Ashton would agree to that, this just seems like lazy journalism from the BBC reporter copying what has been rumoured. |
On Broja's part: he may be unwilling to sign permanently this summer, given the risk of relegation for newly promoted sides (likely to be the case IMO).
On our part: the financial risk of signing him permanently this summer may be too great for us, with the relegation risk, or there may be a PSR case for delaying the first transfer instalment by one season.
On Chelsea's part: the obligation to buy may be integral to them agreeing to our loan offer, even if it is contingent on something far from certain.
If one of the above is true and if we consider the transfer fee to represent fair value today, as well as him being someone we're very keen on, it makes sense that we'd agree to this deal. The danger of committing to sign a player a year in advance, only for them to have a terrible season with us on loan beforehand, may make fans uneasy, but it isn't truly much different to signing said player permanently today (and then watching that terrible season play out). At least here we're spared the financial hit in case of relegation, as opposed to if we bought him now. A loan with option to buy would have been even better obviously but surely not on the table, or we would have taken it; I see this as the second safest deal. | | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 06:03 - Aug 21 with 4373 views | PioneerBlue |
All things will have been agreed in advance for this to be a true loan to buy deal although I have read separately it would be pending us agreeing a contract next summer via BBC.
That being the case, the main risk here is footballing risk, he’s played so little football and will carry a lot of pressure to perform in our team, and to achieve an inflated Chelsea valuation. We know Chelsea is not a particularly well run commercial business and is able to chuck cash at things but they do have a habit of identifying and obtaining good talent and KMck does have a habit of bringing the best out of players. Forget the value for now, we might not be able to agree a contract next summer, but I’m excited to see what we can do with serious top talent like this. [Post edited 21 Aug 2024 6:50]
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 06:51 - Aug 21 with 4169 views | mikeybloo88 |
What happens if we stay up and he’s only played a few games for whatever reason...e.g. injury/poor form/attitude...would we be obligated to buy him then? There must surely be some strict conditions included in the agreement that must be met before we’re mandated to buy. I’d doubt that Ashton would agree to buy no matter what.. |  | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 07:59 - Aug 21 with 3858 views | BloomBlue |
As I said on another chat, the Chelsea bods in the pub last night were laughing their heads off at £30m. I think the expression was 'a fool and their money...'. Their point being Gallagher, a proven PL player, is being sold for £35m, and he's worth a lot more than Broja, certainly a lot more than the £5m difference.
Although to be fair they actually felt the quoted £30m has to be incorrect. |  | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 08:02 - Aug 21 with 3798 views | chicoazul |
Genius
🙄 |  |
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 08:03 - Aug 21 with 3758 views | SheffordBlue |
Think the wording used on one of the tweets was "£30m full deal value". That will include the money give them this season for wages which is probably around £4-5m and then any performance based top ups after the deal becomes permanent. It's probably closer to £20m 'upfront' fee if/when it becomes a permanent deal. | |
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 08:11 - Aug 21 with 3615 views | Churchman |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 07:59 - Aug 21 by BloomBlue |
As I said on another chat, the Chelsea bods in the pub last night were laughing their heads off at £30m. I think the expression was 'a fool and their money...'. Their point being Gallagher, a proven PL player, is being sold for £35m, and he's worth a lot more than Broja, certainly a lot more than the £5m difference.
Although to be fair they actually felt the quoted £30m has to be incorrect. |
There’s a fair bit of irony in Chelsea fans talking about a fool and his money given what their owner has been up to at that circus of a club.
As it goes, I’d be very surprised if the fee was anywhere near that. |  | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 08:18 - Aug 21 with 3499 views | ArnieM |
Monopoly money being talked about on a Renault basis now. Has anyone just stopped for a moment to consider how much everyone connected with the club now gets paid? I’m living just a stokes throw from the training ground and I can’t believe there are upwards of 25 players, most of whom are probably now multi millionaires……scarweeeee times.  |  |
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 08:24 - Aug 21 with 3410 views | NthQldITFC |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 08:18 - Aug 21 by ArnieM |
Monopoly money being talked about on a Renault basis now. Has anyone just stopped for a moment to consider how much everyone connected with the club now gets paid? I’m living just a stokes throw from the training ground and I can’t believe there are upwards of 25 players, most of whom are probably now multi millionaires……scarweeeee times. |
I hadn't considered that, but Mégane have a good think about it now. |  |
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 08:29 - Aug 21 with 3346 views | Metal_Hacker |
Perhaps right now I wouldn’t consider it being “GENUIS” but in 18 months time when we’ve maintained out position in the Premie League and AB has bagged 18+ goals this season and Real Madrid come in for a bid of £80m - I’d then consider that GENUIS |  |
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 08:45 - Aug 21 with 3131 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 07:59 - Aug 21 by BloomBlue |
As I said on another chat, the Chelsea bods in the pub last night were laughing their heads off at £30m. I think the expression was 'a fool and their money...'. Their point being Gallagher, a proven PL player, is being sold for £35m, and he's worth a lot more than Broja, certainly a lot more than the £5m difference.
Although to be fair they actually felt the quoted £30m has to be incorrect. |
It isn't £30m though. It's a circa £5m loan fee this year and if we stay up it is a permanent deal in the region of £25m-£30m. That could look a fantastic deal if he scores 10+ goals and keeps us up but it's not really worth thinking about that until we get there. | | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 08:51 - Aug 21 with 3063 views | gordon |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 07:59 - Aug 21 by BloomBlue |
As I said on another chat, the Chelsea bods in the pub last night were laughing their heads off at £30m. I think the expression was 'a fool and their money...'. Their point being Gallagher, a proven PL player, is being sold for £35m, and he's worth a lot more than Broja, certainly a lot more than the £5m difference.
Although to be fair they actually felt the quoted £30m has to be incorrect. |
Selling Gallagher for £35m is crazy though compared to the prices we've seen this summer, eg Rutter going for £40m.
I'm not convinced that Broja will do it for us though, he's basically done nothing at all since his ACL injury. |  | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 09:39 - Aug 21 with 2725 views | rickw |
If he scored 15 goals he'll probably worth around 30m, if he gets just 5 then 30m would be a huge rip-off!! Hopefully that's just an option we have - we can chose to buy him for 30m if we want.... |  |
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 09:42 - Aug 21 with 2704 views | Steve_M |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 08:02 - Aug 21 by chicoazul |
Genius
🙄 |
I do fear that some people have never seen football clubs get it wrong before.
Maybe we stay up and this deal works well, maybe we don't and then everyone reassesses in hindsight. Perhaps rather better to stay open-minded. |  |
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 09:54 - Aug 21 with 2597 views | Dubtractor |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 09:42 - Aug 21 by Steve_M |
I do fear that some people have never seen football clubs get it wrong before.
Maybe we stay up and this deal works well, maybe we don't and then everyone reassesses in hindsight. Perhaps rather better to stay open-minded. |
I'm reasonably relaxed about it - if we'd paid the £30m upfront, then its a hell of a risk on fee and salary, but if we keep him then we've stayed up and got the funds to cover it. I'm trying to not get too excited by the money involved this Summer, as its just the market we're in now.
The deals for Broja and Cajuste (and Phillips albeit without the buy clause) are exactly the sort of deals we'll need to do to get the 'established' PL quality players that we need. They would mostly cost too much upfront all in one go, and we'd also struggle to convince them to sign for a relegation favourite on a longer term basis.
But no, definitely not a 'genius' bit of business, and definitely has the scope to go wrong - though any big money deal has that risk, including Omari, Delap etc. This is football though, and some deals work and some don't, and that's not unique to ITFC. |  |
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 09:57 - Aug 21 with 2570 views | tcblue |
It's still difficult - after 22 years in lower leagues - to come to terms with the money aspect of the PL.
Bigger rewards mean bigger risks. I'm sure the likes of Broadhead and Morsy were not on 'League One' money when we signed them | | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 10:00 - Aug 21 with 2517 views | Bellevue_Blue |
They'll have to agree to personal terms on the future transfer before signing the deal today.
It carries just as much reward as risk IMO. If he's brilliant, £30M will be a snip and the contract he has signed this summer will likely be good value.
For him to have little/no impact and for us to stay up would be pretty strange you'd have thought. | | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 10:02 - Aug 21 with 2494 views | Steve_M |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 09:54 - Aug 21 by Dubtractor |
I'm reasonably relaxed about it - if we'd paid the £30m upfront, then its a hell of a risk on fee and salary, but if we keep him then we've stayed up and got the funds to cover it. I'm trying to not get too excited by the money involved this Summer, as its just the market we're in now.
The deals for Broja and Cajuste (and Phillips albeit without the buy clause) are exactly the sort of deals we'll need to do to get the 'established' PL quality players that we need. They would mostly cost too much upfront all in one go, and we'd also struggle to convince them to sign for a relegation favourite on a longer term basis.
But no, definitely not a 'genius' bit of business, and definitely has the scope to go wrong - though any big money deal has that risk, including Omari, Delap etc. This is football though, and some deals work and some don't, and that's not unique to ITFC. |
Yes, broadly similar.
I'm just uncomfortable with the hagiography before we've achieved very much at this level. Reminiscing on the hubris when we relegated Man City yesterday just adds to that feeling. | |
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 10:02 - Aug 21 with 2490 views | DecageBruce |
My point was, and maybe not well made, that £30 mill seems steep for a player with little Prem history but, in the wording of the BBC, we need to agree a contract with the player for the perm deal to be completed.
Therefore, come the end of the season, even if the loan has worked out and he’s scored goals to keep us up, if we are unwilling to meet the fee then we just ensure that we don’t offer a worthy contract and therefore we don’t need to complete the deal (should the BBC report be correct) | | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 10:15 - Aug 21 with 2189 views | CastroSito |
Reports now saying that Broja hasn't agreed a contract for the permanent signing after his loan if the obligation is met.
Seems to me like he's very reluctant to join | | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 10:18 - Aug 21 with 2169 views | chicoazul |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 10:02 - Aug 21 by Steve_M |
Yes, broadly similar.
I'm just uncomfortable with the hagiography before we've achieved very much at this level. Reminiscing on the hubris when we relegated Man City yesterday just adds to that feeling. |
Same same my G. Strong Hurst replacing Waghorn with Ellis Harrison vibes going on right now. | |
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| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 10:18 - Aug 21 with 2165 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
Even ’established’ teams can drop - in fact all 3 newly promoted teams being relegated is an outlier. Point being even signing £30m+ players when we’ve been up for three years is a risk - but a necessary one to survive.
You’d think the TV money is a decent leveller for anyone outside the big six. So I’d be surprised if we aren’t already ahead of the likes of Brentford and Bournemouth on projected income for this season (bigger gate receipts, shirt sales etc). | | | |
| Broja Deal - Ashton Genius? on 10:31 - Aug 21 with 2047 views | cressi |
Costing us about 3.7 millon over a season in wages if the worst happens what striker can you buy for that. | | | |
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