| Free speech 23:36 - Nov 1 with 11534 views | airliner |
It’s obvious from all the people against me on here, hate Paul Lambert, the Tory government, and any differing opinion other than their own. It’s full of rabid socialists , who won’t allow anybody their own opinions. I have been called so many names I can’t count.
I respect your right to express but to be totally really rude and aggressively opposed to debate is wrong.
I respect your right to say what you want , being called a see you next Tuesday is wrong, even if you disagree and told to go forth and multiply. Get a grip. We live in a democracy, not a Stalinist state, where we are told to just shut up and be shot. I take your views on board and understand. |  | | |  |
| Free speech on 14:50 - Nov 2 with 2487 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| Free speech on 14:13 - Nov 2 by noggin |
Like I said, it's not opinions that cause the conflict but lack of facts/evidence. You can have an opinion that Norwood is better that Messi but you'll get called out on it because the evidence doesn't support it. |
Its not the calling out that I've ever seen an issue with, we all have different opinions, we are all built different, its human nature.
It the way people call each other out, it instantly because sledging match on here, with people just aiming to 1 up each other, and I've fallen into it where I have ended up in sledging matches.
But its needless, we are all just humans on the other end of keyboard, there is never a need to get personal, especially on people we don't need personally. |  |
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| Free speech on 14:52 - Nov 2 with 2482 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| Free speech on 14:35 - Nov 2 by The_Flashing_Smile |
The problem is airliner's views aren't nice. In fact they're often downright offensive. |
I don't know airliner, and have never actually come across him username before. But like I said, I'm not talking about this particular incident, more jsut about TWTD as a wider community. | |
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| Free speech on 14:55 - Nov 2 with 2463 views | DanTheMan |
| Free speech on 14:45 - Nov 2 by 26_Paz |
That’s your opinion mate and your welcome to it. Airliner is also welcome to his opinions |
The funny thing is, what he said isn't an opinion really. It's a statement of fact. Either you do or don't.
Which is kind of what people are saying. |  |
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| Free speech on 14:58 - Nov 2 with 2453 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Free speech on 14:52 - Nov 2 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
I don't know airliner, and have never actually come across him username before. But like I said, I'm not talking about this particular incident, more jsut about TWTD as a wider community. |
There's a huge difference between ganging up on someone for no reason and several people calling out someone's wrong and sometimes offensive views.
You need to separate the two. |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Free speech on 14:58 - Nov 2 with 2448 views | Kropotkin123 |
| Free speech on 11:54 - Nov 2 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I'm about to lose my job, and I don't personally know anyone who's suffered with or died from Covid, but I still respect the science, and thus the restrictions.
It's the people who aren't taking this seriously who piss me off the most and who I blame for me losing my job, because their idiocy and flippancy is what's prolonging this and ultimately crippling the economy. |
Totally agree. If everyone took it seriously then the transmission rate would reduce. This of course doesn't mean that the government get a pass on their failures. |  |
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| Free speech on 15:06 - Nov 2 with 2425 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| Free speech on 14:58 - Nov 2 by The_Flashing_Smile |
There's a huge difference between ganging up on someone for no reason and several people calling out someone's wrong and sometimes offensive views.
You need to separate the two. |
Who are we to call out other peoples opinions or views, we are no better nor worse than anyone else on here, you get the sense that some people on here may think they are better than others, or maybe because they've been posting a little longer should seen as the face that runs the place.
We can differ in opinions to people, we don't need to nasty to other people because of it.
You may be under a different username now, but you've been around long enough. | |
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| Free speech on 15:26 - Nov 2 with 2391 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Free speech on 15:06 - Nov 2 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
Who are we to call out other peoples opinions or views, we are no better nor worse than anyone else on here, you get the sense that some people on here may think they are better than others, or maybe because they've been posting a little longer should seen as the face that runs the place.
We can differ in opinions to people, we don't need to nasty to other people because of it.
You may be under a different username now, but you've been around long enough. |
I think you're missing the point fella. if someone blatantly lies about factual statistics in order to play down a pandemic that's killing thousands of people, then yes, they ARE worse than me and I reserve the right to say so, as does anyone else, regardless of how long anyone's been here.
Are you seriously suggesting people should have free reign to post whatever the hell they like and people shouldn't be allowed to say, "hang on a minute..."? | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Free speech on 15:29 - Nov 2 with 2369 views | Ryorry |
| Free speech on 15:06 - Nov 2 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
Who are we to call out other peoples opinions or views, we are no better nor worse than anyone else on here, you get the sense that some people on here may think they are better than others, or maybe because they've been posting a little longer should seen as the face that runs the place.
We can differ in opinions to people, we don't need to nasty to other people because of it.
You may be under a different username now, but you've been around long enough. |
I think what FS is saying (and I agree) is that people really *should* get called out for fake news, esp where it's dangerously misleading such as misinformation in a pandemic etc; and for racism, homophobia etc., but that it's unacceptable for people to be on the end of abuse for their general feelings, views etc., esp where several other people are joining in for no good reason.
Edit: written before I saw your post of 15.26, FS [Post edited 2 Nov 2020 15:30]
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| Free speech on 15:32 - Nov 2 with 2377 views | J2BLUE |
| Free speech on 14:45 - Nov 2 by 26_Paz |
That’s your opinion mate and your welcome to it. Airliner is also welcome to his opinions |
Opinions are great when it's subjective. Do you like chocolate ice cream? Great, give us your opinion.
Someone having an opinion which is proven incorrect by actual facts has no entitlement to be taken seriously or have their opinion respected. If I said to you my opinion is that Trump is really a Russian double agent working to bring down America from the inside i'm sure you'd call me an idiot.
People have the opinion that the earth is flat, that the virus is a hoax or that Keith Lemon is funny. That doesn't make them right. |  |
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| The problem is that some people on here.... on 15:37 - Nov 2 with 2363 views | Bloots |
| Free speech on 15:26 - Nov 2 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I think you're missing the point fella. if someone blatantly lies about factual statistics in order to play down a pandemic that's killing thousands of people, then yes, they ARE worse than me and I reserve the right to say so, as does anyone else, regardless of how long anyone's been here.
Are you seriously suggesting people should have free reign to post whatever the hell they like and people shouldn't be allowed to say, "hang on a minute..."? |
....(and I'm genuinely not talking about you here) don't just leave it at "calling them out" or saying "hang on a minute" they take their disagreement way, way too far.
Things have been getting really offensive lately in some quarters, with some people going OTT.
"I vote Tory"........"then you can f*ck off you racist scum"
"I vote Labour"......"then up yours, Commie tw*t"
People should just tell the individual they don't agree with them, attempt to debate it and then just let it go in the safe knowledge that they are comfortable with their own opinions. |  |
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| Lambert OUT (n/t) on 15:49 - Nov 2 with 2328 views | Swansea_Blue |
| The problem is that some people on here.... on 15:37 - Nov 2 by Bloots |
....(and I'm genuinely not talking about you here) don't just leave it at "calling them out" or saying "hang on a minute" they take their disagreement way, way too far.
Things have been getting really offensive lately in some quarters, with some people going OTT.
"I vote Tory"........"then you can f*ck off you racist scum"
"I vote Labour"......"then up yours, Commie tw*t"
People should just tell the individual they don't agree with them, attempt to debate it and then just let it go in the safe knowledge that they are comfortable with their own opinions. |
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| Free speech on 16:13 - Nov 2 with 2294 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| Free speech on 15:26 - Nov 2 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I think you're missing the point fella. if someone blatantly lies about factual statistics in order to play down a pandemic that's killing thousands of people, then yes, they ARE worse than me and I reserve the right to say so, as does anyone else, regardless of how long anyone's been here.
Are you seriously suggesting people should have free reign to post whatever the hell they like and people shouldn't be allowed to say, "hang on a minute..."? |
No I think you've missed my point, I think I said on my first post, I have no idea nor do I particulary care what airliner said, it's nothing to do with me.
I'm talking about the wider community of TWTD where there as in issue with certain people who are more hell bent on arguing in rude and vulgar that isn't really needed.
I agree, if you think something you've read differs to your opinion, you are well within your rights to say so.
But that doesn't mean people need to be rude and nasty to get their point across, that's anyone, you, me, airliner.... we don't need to be nasty to each other because we differ in views. | |
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| Free speech on 16:14 - Nov 2 with 2287 views | jeera |
| Free speech on 16:13 - Nov 2 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
No I think you've missed my point, I think I said on my first post, I have no idea nor do I particulary care what airliner said, it's nothing to do with me.
I'm talking about the wider community of TWTD where there as in issue with certain people who are more hell bent on arguing in rude and vulgar that isn't really needed.
I agree, if you think something you've read differs to your opinion, you are well within your rights to say so.
But that doesn't mean people need to be rude and nasty to get their point across, that's anyone, you, me, airliner.... we don't need to be nasty to each other because we differ in views. |
What if someone made crass comments about people dying?
Is it ok to then be beastly to them in return? |  |
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| Free speech on 16:15 - Nov 2 with 2285 views | SpruceMoose |
| Free speech on 16:13 - Nov 2 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
No I think you've missed my point, I think I said on my first post, I have no idea nor do I particulary care what airliner said, it's nothing to do with me.
I'm talking about the wider community of TWTD where there as in issue with certain people who are more hell bent on arguing in rude and vulgar that isn't really needed.
I agree, if you think something you've read differs to your opinion, you are well within your rights to say so.
But that doesn't mean people need to be rude and nasty to get their point across, that's anyone, you, me, airliner.... we don't need to be nasty to each other because we differ in views. |
What if one of those views is racist/bigoted/dangerous though?
Fake civility under those circumstances just lends respectability to opinions that really just deserve contempt. |  |
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| Free speech on 16:15 - Nov 2 with 2285 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| Free speech on 15:29 - Nov 2 by Ryorry |
I think what FS is saying (and I agree) is that people really *should* get called out for fake news, esp where it's dangerously misleading such as misinformation in a pandemic etc; and for racism, homophobia etc., but that it's unacceptable for people to be on the end of abuse for their general feelings, views etc., esp where several other people are joining in for no good reason.
Edit: written before I saw your post of 15.26, FS [Post edited 2 Nov 2020 15:30]
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See response to FS. Is there an issue with saying "hold on, I don't think that's right because...", absolutely no!
But this place can turn toxic when that happens, and more often than not people lose track of what the were debating and just end up in a sledging match. | |
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| Free speech on 16:17 - Nov 2 with 2276 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Free speech on 16:13 - Nov 2 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
No I think you've missed my point, I think I said on my first post, I have no idea nor do I particulary care what airliner said, it's nothing to do with me.
I'm talking about the wider community of TWTD where there as in issue with certain people who are more hell bent on arguing in rude and vulgar that isn't really needed.
I agree, if you think something you've read differs to your opinion, you are well within your rights to say so.
But that doesn't mean people need to be rude and nasty to get their point across, that's anyone, you, me, airliner.... we don't need to be nasty to each other because we differ in views. |
I give up. You posted this in airliner's thread, and you've included him in your list here as well.
Not everyone is equal and not every opinion is equal. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Free speech on 16:19 - Nov 2 with 2263 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| Free speech on 16:15 - Nov 2 by SpruceMoose |
What if one of those views is racist/bigoted/dangerous though?
Fake civility under those circumstances just lends respectability to opinions that really just deserve contempt. |
Of course such comments aren't neccassry, report and let Phil deal with accordingly.
You don't need to turn aggressive/rude or personal over it.
Just my opinion, I like to go through life trying to get on with as many people as I can, try to give people the benefit of the doubt etc. Always have and always will live by 'it's nice to be nice, free to be nice'. | |
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| Free speech on 16:20 - Nov 2 with 2255 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Free speech on 13:56 - Nov 2 by 26_Paz |
Unfortunately, there are those on here who think this forum is their own private what’s app group for them and their mates. They see anyone with different views as a threat to their monopoly and therefore abuse them to try and get them to leave. It’s a shame, really. |
I welcome everyone's views on Battenberg, but reserve the right to hound them off the board if they give the wrong answer - I mean do we hear much from Facters and Footers nowadays? |  |
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| Free speech on 16:22 - Nov 2 with 2251 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| Free speech on 16:17 - Nov 2 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I give up. You posted this in airliner's thread, and you've included him in your list here as well.
Not everyone is equal and not every opinion is equal. |
Because whilst he is obviously unhappy about something, I don't know what has happened, like I said it has nothing to do with me.
A small part of his rant about their being a problem with certain posters who don't like it when someone differs in opinion to them is unfortunately true in my opinion. Hence why I commented with my opinion.
"Not everyone is equal and not every opinion is equal." - That's a very dangerous and silly thing to say. [Post edited 2 Nov 2020 16:23]
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| Free speech on 16:23 - Nov 2 with 2239 views | jeera |
| Free speech on 16:19 - Nov 2 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
Of course such comments aren't neccassry, report and let Phil deal with accordingly.
You don't need to turn aggressive/rude or personal over it.
Just my opinion, I like to go through life trying to get on with as many people as I can, try to give people the benefit of the doubt etc. Always have and always will live by 'it's nice to be nice, free to be nice'. |
In your other post you have literally said, "I don't care what ****** said"
Isn't that missing the point?
So he could say, "I hope you and your family die in a plane crash", and you're ok with that but not any nasty responses.
Give over mate.
He has downplayed the virus and shown no consideration for those who have so far lost their lives, nor their families because, "they would have died anyway."
If a close member of my family had died and someone said that, I wouldn't be saying nice things to them.
You're taking the high ground whilst completely ignoring all context. We can all do that on other people's behalf, that's easy. | |
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| Free speech on 16:27 - Nov 2 with 2220 views | jeera |
| Free speech on 16:22 - Nov 2 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
Because whilst he is obviously unhappy about something, I don't know what has happened, like I said it has nothing to do with me.
A small part of his rant about their being a problem with certain posters who don't like it when someone differs in opinion to them is unfortunately true in my opinion. Hence why I commented with my opinion.
"Not everyone is equal and not every opinion is equal." - That's a very dangerous and silly thing to say. [Post edited 2 Nov 2020 16:23]
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"Not everyone is equal and not every opinion is equal." - That's a very dangerous and silly thing to say."
No it isn't. It's common sense.
I wouldn't wander into a Boeing workshop and start telling their engineers how to repair their jets' engines because my opinion is as valid as theirs.
People say opinions aren't equal for good reason, not because it sounds a fun thing to say. | |
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| The problem is that some people on here.... on 16:28 - Nov 2 with 2217 views | Churchman |
| The problem is that some people on here.... on 15:37 - Nov 2 by Bloots |
....(and I'm genuinely not talking about you here) don't just leave it at "calling them out" or saying "hang on a minute" they take their disagreement way, way too far.
Things have been getting really offensive lately in some quarters, with some people going OTT.
"I vote Tory"........"then you can f*ck off you racist scum"
"I vote Labour"......"then up yours, Commie tw*t"
People should just tell the individual they don't agree with them, attempt to debate it and then just let it go in the safe knowledge that they are comfortable with their own opinions. |
I agree with this totally. There is a line to be drawn. Disagreeing with somebody is absolutely fine - it’s one of the benefits of this board. Challenging what somebody says is also fine for the same reasons. Personal abuse is not ok regardless of what one may think of a poster’s comments. |  | | |
| Free speech on 16:35 - Nov 2 with 2189 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| Free speech on 16:23 - Nov 2 by jeera |
In your other post you have literally said, "I don't care what ****** said"
Isn't that missing the point?
So he could say, "I hope you and your family die in a plane crash", and you're ok with that but not any nasty responses.
Give over mate.
He has downplayed the virus and shown no consideration for those who have so far lost their lives, nor their families because, "they would have died anyway."
If a close member of my family had died and someone said that, I wouldn't be saying nice things to them.
You're taking the high ground whilst completely ignoring all context. We can all do that on other people's behalf, that's easy. |
"I don't care what ****** said" - what I meant by that is I don't know what he said, it's nothing to do with me, I didn't mean that as he can say what he likes at it's ok, I just didn't know what was said.
If he has said the things you have suggested, I think they aren't needed, disturbing, insensitve, and very poor from airliner if true.
I've had work a work colleague who's mother passed from Covid, another in hospital for a period of time, I wouldn't dream of being insensitive to them.
I think my point is being misconstrued a little, I'm not defending this OP in particular, merely stating there is a problem with certain posters on here who don't like it when someone's opinion is different to their own, and often turn to personal insults. It's a shame really, should be a friendly place where ITFC fans come together.
Have a look at Bloots' previous post, summed up what my point was trying to be perfectly. No need for you to get angry or worked up. [Post edited 2 Nov 2020 16:38]
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| Free speech on 16:36 - Nov 2 with 2183 views | TheTrueBlue1878 |
| Free speech on 16:27 - Nov 2 by jeera |
"Not everyone is equal and not every opinion is equal." - That's a very dangerous and silly thing to say."
No it isn't. It's common sense.
I wouldn't wander into a Boeing workshop and start telling their engineers how to repair their jets' engines because my opinion is as valid as theirs.
People say opinions aren't equal for good reason, not because it sounds a fun thing to say. |
You are being a little silly now, I would take a step back from responding to anymore of my threads.
You are clearly getting yourself worked up over something where it is not needed. | |
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| Free speech on 16:37 - Nov 2 with 2181 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Free speech on 16:19 - Nov 2 by TheTrueBlue1878 |
Of course such comments aren't neccassry, report and let Phil deal with accordingly.
You don't need to turn aggressive/rude or personal over it.
Just my opinion, I like to go through life trying to get on with as many people as I can, try to give people the benefit of the doubt etc. Always have and always will live by 'it's nice to be nice, free to be nice'. |
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