| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard 00:35 - Mar 10 with 12405 views | hatch |
Been following this closely since she went missing near Clapham last Wednesday. They’ve just announced they’ve arrested a Met police officer.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-56342465
And bizarrely at the same time I was messaging my friend to say ‘what sort of person would gain trust with a woman? A police officer possibly?’ and literally 10 seconds later we saw the news break on Twitter.
Such a worrying case and the outcome doesn’t look promising but at least an arrest has been made. |  | | |  |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 22:44 - Mar 10 with 1735 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 20:26 - Mar 10 by ITFC_96 |
Human remains now found. |
Sickening. |  |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 12:41 - Mar 11 with 1527 views | Ryorry |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 18:02 - Mar 10 by bluelagos |
"People should be able to walk where they like, when they like under all situations, but they can't. No need for any attempts at point-scoring..."
Don't think it's about point scoring - I've got no history or strong issue with anyone on this thread. Was just pointing out why I think asking the question was at best insensitive and certainly uncalled for.
Everyone on this thread is disgusted at what appears to have happened (We don't know for sure yet). Happy to stand down - perhaps if there's any female TWTDrs on here, they can share their thoughts given it just seems to be men discussing how women may or may not feel...
(although Bankster's link gives a clear guide) |
Very complex issue, hence I didn't reply last night as too tired - and it still really requires a lengthier reply than I have time for, but in brief -
As a female born in the middle of the last century, you simply grew up with almost invisible, silent signals from a variety of sources that you needed to be careful about your safety. To a certain extent that was also true for boys - all kids were taught not to accept lifts from strangers (I once did, age 11, & was v. v. lucky as it was from a good guy & resulted in saving my mother's life, but that's another story).
Having grown up as a cis female, I've absolutely no idea how different the fear/safety thing is for us compared with how it is for men. There are some situations where actually I've felt much safer *because* I'm a woman, not a man - e.g. at some football matches at Anfield, Leeds, Maine Road etc where there was quite regularly male-male violence on away supporters. As a woman, I just didn't feel I was a likely target.
Having said that, there was an interesting thread on Twitter yesterday following from one woman wondering out loud "what would you do if Men had a nightime curfew?" - the answers showed, sadly, just how much women in 2021 feel they have to curtail their lives to stay safe. At the same time of course, the incidence of knife crime against young men in cities has grown horrifically, so safety issues aren't just a one gender thing - there are also, sadly, still assaults against the disabled & LGBT communities happening regularly (if you didn't catch the lengthy Gareth Thomas interview on R5l on Tuesday afternoon between about 2.15-4.30pm, I urge you to do so, it was amazing).
It's not just an extra layer of problems re physical safety that you inherit growing up as a female though - sadly that's just part of centuries-old discrimination across many cultures world-wide - everything from many male doctors' attitudes to women at least until the last 20 years; the glass ceiling; until quite recently, women who became pregnant outside marriage being vilified & ostracized while the fathers were regarded as "just sowing their wild oats haha"; countries like Saudi Arabia still literally locking up their daughters rather than allow them any freedom - etc. |  |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:08 - Mar 11 with 1460 views | Crawfordsboot |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 18:02 - Mar 10 by bluelagos |
"People should be able to walk where they like, when they like under all situations, but they can't. No need for any attempts at point-scoring..."
Don't think it's about point scoring - I've got no history or strong issue with anyone on this thread. Was just pointing out why I think asking the question was at best insensitive and certainly uncalled for.
Everyone on this thread is disgusted at what appears to have happened (We don't know for sure yet). Happy to stand down - perhaps if there's any female TWTDrs on here, they can share their thoughts given it just seems to be men discussing how women may or may not feel...
(although Bankster's link gives a clear guide) |
This is such a horrible situation. I feel for the family and friends who will find it hard to avoid reports of what appear to be human remains being found.
Today the media is full of commentators, including politicians and feminist lobbyists nearly all presenting the general situation as high risk for women in society. I in no way wish to diminish the horror of this individual case but whenever there is this level of public outcry I find it useful to refer back to the facts.
In 20019/20 in the UK there were 279 homicides of people aged 16-34. Of those 225 were male and 54 were women. So a man is more than 4 times as likely to be killed as a woman. Similarly the only stats I can find show that where spouse murders spouse for every 100 women killed by a husband there are 70 men killed by their wives.
I find this sort of information useful in that it can help us avoid the knee jerk reaction and jumping to conclusions. Women (if I can generalise) are better at expressing their emotions and fears than men are. As a result we have groups lobbying politically to reclaim the streets for women etc. When perhaps it would be much more appropriate to simply lobby to reclaim the streets for the safety of all of us as individuals.To lobby just for women undermines the importance this.
Also if you consider that of the 54 women killed in the UK last year the majority will have been killed by an assailant known to them then it highlights what a rare occurrence a random murder of a young woman is.
That though does not diminish the horror of this individual case. [Post edited 11 Mar 2021 14:10]
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:18 - Mar 11 with 1434 views | SpruceMoose |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:08 - Mar 11 by Crawfordsboot |
This is such a horrible situation. I feel for the family and friends who will find it hard to avoid reports of what appear to be human remains being found.
Today the media is full of commentators, including politicians and feminist lobbyists nearly all presenting the general situation as high risk for women in society. I in no way wish to diminish the horror of this individual case but whenever there is this level of public outcry I find it useful to refer back to the facts.
In 20019/20 in the UK there were 279 homicides of people aged 16-34. Of those 225 were male and 54 were women. So a man is more than 4 times as likely to be killed as a woman. Similarly the only stats I can find show that where spouse murders spouse for every 100 women killed by a husband there are 70 men killed by their wives.
I find this sort of information useful in that it can help us avoid the knee jerk reaction and jumping to conclusions. Women (if I can generalise) are better at expressing their emotions and fears than men are. As a result we have groups lobbying politically to reclaim the streets for women etc. When perhaps it would be much more appropriate to simply lobby to reclaim the streets for the safety of all of us as individuals.To lobby just for women undermines the importance this.
Also if you consider that of the 54 women killed in the UK last year the majority will have been killed by an assailant known to them then it highlights what a rare occurrence a random murder of a young woman is.
That though does not diminish the horror of this individual case. [Post edited 11 Mar 2021 14:10]
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Although, obviously a woman doesn't have to die for it to be counted as violence against her committed by a man. The commentary I've seen has largely been a comment on violence against women in general, not just the murder of women.
Not wishing to insult anyone, but your post rather does seem like the All Lives Matter equivalent of violence against women. [Post edited 11 Mar 2021 14:19]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:35 - Mar 11 with 1390 views | clive_baker |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:18 - Mar 11 by SpruceMoose |
Although, obviously a woman doesn't have to die for it to be counted as violence against her committed by a man. The commentary I've seen has largely been a comment on violence against women in general, not just the murder of women.
Not wishing to insult anyone, but your post rather does seem like the All Lives Matter equivalent of violence against women. [Post edited 11 Mar 2021 14:19]
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This.
I just find the fact people are bringing up statistics and analysing trends at this time a little uncomfortable to be honest with you. We all know the reality without the analysis paralysis. Whichever way you cut it, women over index in terms of murder victims relative to assailants, as is the case for other forms of physical attack. That's a fact, and there's not really much more that needs to be said on that.
I guess it's much easier for a cowardly c*** to pick on a 5ft 4, size 6 woman than a bloke. It's heart breaking and as a father to a little girl myself I can't even comprehend what her family must be going through. She did nothing wrong whatsoever, she was simply in the wrong place at the wrong time. It could've been anyone.
I hope they establish who is responsible, put them behind bars and throw away the keys. |  |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:42 - Mar 11 with 1367 views | Crawfordsboot |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:18 - Mar 11 by SpruceMoose |
Although, obviously a woman doesn't have to die for it to be counted as violence against her committed by a man. The commentary I've seen has largely been a comment on violence against women in general, not just the murder of women.
Not wishing to insult anyone, but your post rather does seem like the All Lives Matter equivalent of violence against women. [Post edited 11 Mar 2021 14:19]
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I am not offended at all and do not mean to draw any comparison with the All lives matter campaigns.
My interest is to
A. Keep things in perspective. This individual case will cause much fear. Since posting I have found info that only approx six percent of homicides of women are carried out by someone unknown to them. The vast majority are by spouses/partners.
B. The reporting tends to demonise men, though men are four times more likely to be victims themselves.
C. Of course I accept that murder is the extreme and that there will be many shades of lesser violence. Though I have no proof I suspect that men suffer more general violence than do women. This individual case is a murder and therefore I used the data on murders for reference. | | | |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:45 - Mar 11 with 1350 views | SpruceMoose |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:42 - Mar 11 by Crawfordsboot |
I am not offended at all and do not mean to draw any comparison with the All lives matter campaigns.
My interest is to
A. Keep things in perspective. This individual case will cause much fear. Since posting I have found info that only approx six percent of homicides of women are carried out by someone unknown to them. The vast majority are by spouses/partners.
B. The reporting tends to demonise men, though men are four times more likely to be victims themselves.
C. Of course I accept that murder is the extreme and that there will be many shades of lesser violence. Though I have no proof I suspect that men suffer more general violence than do women. This individual case is a murder and therefore I used the data on murders for reference. |
Who do you suspect commits this 'general' violence on men in the main?
Could it be... Other men? Not sure the best advert for men is to say they're ecumenical abusers.
Honestly, I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here or why. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:48 - Mar 11 with 1341 views | Ryorry |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:42 - Mar 11 by Crawfordsboot |
I am not offended at all and do not mean to draw any comparison with the All lives matter campaigns.
My interest is to
A. Keep things in perspective. This individual case will cause much fear. Since posting I have found info that only approx six percent of homicides of women are carried out by someone unknown to them. The vast majority are by spouses/partners.
B. The reporting tends to demonise men, though men are four times more likely to be victims themselves.
C. Of course I accept that murder is the extreme and that there will be many shades of lesser violence. Though I have no proof I suspect that men suffer more general violence than do women. This individual case is a murder and therefore I used the data on murders for reference. |
"Though I have no proof I suspect that men suffer more general violence than do women."
You definitely do need to support such an assertion with evidence. | |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:56 - Mar 11 with 1323 views | CBBlue |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:42 - Mar 11 by Crawfordsboot |
I am not offended at all and do not mean to draw any comparison with the All lives matter campaigns.
My interest is to
A. Keep things in perspective. This individual case will cause much fear. Since posting I have found info that only approx six percent of homicides of women are carried out by someone unknown to them. The vast majority are by spouses/partners.
B. The reporting tends to demonise men, though men are four times more likely to be victims themselves.
C. Of course I accept that murder is the extreme and that there will be many shades of lesser violence. Though I have no proof I suspect that men suffer more general violence than do women. This individual case is a murder and therefore I used the data on murders for reference. |
As a woman, when walking alone I find myself (like many women I imagine) routinely holding my keys ready to defend myself, walking in the middle of a road to avoid entrances to alleyways etc, crossing the road and pretending to be on the phone to name a few. In truth it's not being murdered that I most fear but being raped or assaulted.
We know most men are not like this but we don't know what ones are so we have to be on high alert at all times.
I've seen some advice to men about crossing the road if they find themselves following a lone woman at night which I'd be really thankful for as it's hard to explain the anxiety and fear you feel when you can hear footsteps approaching behind you. |  |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:58 - Mar 11 with 1299 views | Crawfordsboot |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:45 - Mar 11 by SpruceMoose |
Who do you suspect commits this 'general' violence on men in the main?
Could it be... Other men? Not sure the best advert for men is to say they're ecumenical abusers.
Honestly, I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here or why. |
Fair comment re the major perpetrators.
My two points stand.
1. Murder of a woman by persons unknown to the victim are extremely rare events.
2. Murder and violence in the UK impacts men far more than it does women, murder 4x, general violence ?x. Our streets need to be made safe for our sons as well as for our daughters. | | | |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:03 - Mar 11 with 1282 views | Crawfordsboot |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:56 - Mar 11 by CBBlue |
As a woman, when walking alone I find myself (like many women I imagine) routinely holding my keys ready to defend myself, walking in the middle of a road to avoid entrances to alleyways etc, crossing the road and pretending to be on the phone to name a few. In truth it's not being murdered that I most fear but being raped or assaulted.
We know most men are not like this but we don't know what ones are so we have to be on high alert at all times.
I've seen some advice to men about crossing the road if they find themselves following a lone woman at night which I'd be really thankful for as it's hard to explain the anxiety and fear you feel when you can hear footsteps approaching behind you. |
You make your point very clearly and powerfully | | | |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:03 - Mar 11 with 1282 views | J2BLUE |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:56 - Mar 11 by CBBlue |
As a woman, when walking alone I find myself (like many women I imagine) routinely holding my keys ready to defend myself, walking in the middle of a road to avoid entrances to alleyways etc, crossing the road and pretending to be on the phone to name a few. In truth it's not being murdered that I most fear but being raped or assaulted.
We know most men are not like this but we don't know what ones are so we have to be on high alert at all times.
I've seen some advice to men about crossing the road if they find themselves following a lone woman at night which I'd be really thankful for as it's hard to explain the anxiety and fear you feel when you can hear footsteps approaching behind you. |
I try and cross the road or at least just slow right down so they can at least see i'm getting further away. It's always a bit awkward, especially at night.
I try and smile at old ladies as well. No idea if this is helpful but it's my way of trying to say don't worry i'm not a weirdo! |  |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:05 - Mar 11 with 1269 views | SpruceMoose |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:58 - Mar 11 by Crawfordsboot |
Fair comment re the major perpetrators.
My two points stand.
1. Murder of a woman by persons unknown to the victim are extremely rare events.
2. Murder and violence in the UK impacts men far more than it does women, murder 4x, general violence ?x. Our streets need to be made safe for our sons as well as for our daughters. |
See, to me, that's pure All Lives Matter thinking.
I'll let someone else pick this up though. I'm busy, but thanks for your thoughts. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:06 - Mar 11 with 1264 views | Radlett_blue |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:58 - Mar 11 by Crawfordsboot |
Fair comment re the major perpetrators.
My two points stand.
1. Murder of a woman by persons unknown to the victim are extremely rare events.
2. Murder and violence in the UK impacts men far more than it does women, murder 4x, general violence ?x. Our streets need to be made safe for our sons as well as for our daughters. |
Indeed, cases like this attract huge amounts of media interest but the reality is that murder or abduction of a woman by a complete stranger is an incredibly rare event. |  |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:06 - Mar 11 with 1262 views | Ryorry |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:03 - Mar 11 by J2BLUE |
I try and cross the road or at least just slow right down so they can at least see i'm getting further away. It's always a bit awkward, especially at night.
I try and smile at old ladies as well. No idea if this is helpful but it's my way of trying to say don't worry i'm not a weirdo! |
"I try and smile at old ladies as well. No idea if this is helpful but it's my way of trying to say don't worry i'm not a weirdo!"
Have you ever considered that might actually have the opposite effect?! 😜 | |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:07 - Mar 11 with 1254 views | J2BLUE |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:06 - Mar 11 by Ryorry |
"I try and smile at old ladies as well. No idea if this is helpful but it's my way of trying to say don't worry i'm not a weirdo!"
Have you ever considered that might actually have the opposite effect?! 😜 |
I knew someone would own me. I'm glad it was you  | |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:11 - Mar 11 with 1242 views | Crawfordsboot |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:48 - Mar 11 by Ryorry |
"Though I have no proof I suspect that men suffer more general violence than do women."
You definitely do need to support such an assertion with evidence. |
Unfortunately the ons.gov.uk site does not provide that but since men are more than four times more likely to be murdered than women it would seem reasonable to assume that they are also more likely to suffer lesser assaults. | | | |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:13 - Mar 11 with 1238 views | Ryorry |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:07 - Mar 11 by J2BLUE |
I knew someone would own me. I'm glad it was you |
Just warn me if you're ever about to travel to North Yorkshire! ;) | |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:15 - Mar 11 with 1223 views | J2BLUE |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:13 - Mar 11 by Ryorry |
Just warn me if you're ever about to travel to North Yorkshire! ;) |
Well i'm not coming now  | |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:16 - Mar 11 with 1219 views | Ryorry |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:11 - Mar 11 by Crawfordsboot |
Unfortunately the ons.gov.uk site does not provide that but since men are more than four times more likely to be murdered than women it would seem reasonable to assume that they are also more likely to suffer lesser assaults. |
I don't think such an assumption is reasonable tbh - you're ignoring the point CBBlue alluded to re rape. | |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:22 - Mar 11 with 1203 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:56 - Mar 11 by CBBlue |
As a woman, when walking alone I find myself (like many women I imagine) routinely holding my keys ready to defend myself, walking in the middle of a road to avoid entrances to alleyways etc, crossing the road and pretending to be on the phone to name a few. In truth it's not being murdered that I most fear but being raped or assaulted.
We know most men are not like this but we don't know what ones are so we have to be on high alert at all times.
I've seen some advice to men about crossing the road if they find themselves following a lone woman at night which I'd be really thankful for as it's hard to explain the anxiety and fear you feel when you can hear footsteps approaching behind you. |
Yes, very powerfully put. I heard this view for the first time a few years ago and it really shocked me. I think a lot of blokes don't appreciate the level of anxiety women feel if they are alone.
I like the tip of crossing the road; I'll try and remember that. I always feel like calling out 'it's ok, I'm not a nutter'. But then that's what a nutter would say! |  |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:29 - Mar 11 with 1184 views | Tangledupin_Blue |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:41 - Mar 10 by hatch |
Suspect arrested on suspicion of kidnap, murder and indecent exposure now.
I think it has been a while since we've had a case like this in fairness but as someone that doesn't live too far away it has really shocked me, my partner and local friends. |
For whatever reason this is a high profile case.
But it is likely that somewhere in this country there is another woman lying in a mortuary and another grieving family. And there are likely to be two more next week and two more the week after and so on.
Circumstances may vary widely. It may be that the perpetrator is, more often than not, known by the victim; it remains to be seen whether that is the case in this instance. But It is not, sadly, an isolated case. It happens on average twice a week; so frequently that cases generally do not make the national press. |  |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:40 - Mar 11 with 1164 views | Crawfordsboot |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:22 - Mar 11 by Swansea_Blue |
Yes, very powerfully put. I heard this view for the first time a few years ago and it really shocked me. I think a lot of blokes don't appreciate the level of anxiety women feel if they are alone.
I like the tip of crossing the road; I'll try and remember that. I always feel like calling out 'it's ok, I'm not a nutter'. But then that's what a nutter would say! |
You said it :) [Post edited 11 Mar 2021 15:41]
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:48 - Mar 11 with 1143 views | Steve_M |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:29 - Mar 11 by Tangledupin_Blue |
For whatever reason this is a high profile case.
But it is likely that somewhere in this country there is another woman lying in a mortuary and another grieving family. And there are likely to be two more next week and two more the week after and so on.
Circumstances may vary widely. It may be that the perpetrator is, more often than not, known by the victim; it remains to be seen whether that is the case in this instance. But It is not, sadly, an isolated case. It happens on average twice a week; so frequently that cases generally do not make the national press. |
According to Jess Phillips on Today this morning, six women and one girl killed in the UK since Sarah Everard disappeared. |  |
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| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 15:50 - Mar 11 with 1138 views | bluelagos |
| Met police officer arrested in connection with missing Sarah Everard on 14:58 - Mar 11 by Crawfordsboot |
Fair comment re the major perpetrators.
My two points stand.
1. Murder of a woman by persons unknown to the victim are extremely rare events.
2. Murder and violence in the UK impacts men far more than it does women, murder 4x, general violence ?x. Our streets need to be made safe for our sons as well as for our daughters. |
I am guessing (I don't know) that one of the issues for many women is quite simply that they are more vulnerable than many men. I have walked in dodgy areas and held my keys ready, watched dubious characters who looked ready to relieve me of my wallet etc. But that fear can't compare to the fear of being raped/sexually assualted which many women will have.
So I do think that irrespective of the stats, we have to understand that women are more likely to feel anxiety/fear when walking alone. How we help them with that (crossing the road if following etc.) is one part of it, but I am uncomfortable with anyone suggesting women should do xyz or avoid xyz.
Whatever they chose to do I am cool with, whether that is avoid situations and or chosing to say "Fck that, I am walking where I want when I want". It is a woman's choice and we should all respect it without ever questioning that choice imho.
By all means point out the statistical unlikelihood of being attacked by a random stranger, but it could still happen and some people will naturally be sh1t scared of that, especially if they have heard of or experienced incidents previously.
Rambling a bit - but thought I'd throw in my thoughts. |  |
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