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Right, I’ll start with the disclaimer that Johnson is a liar and a charlatan, a c*nt, the current government is a shambles etc, etc, but are you aware that his “oven ready deal” was the withdrawal agreement, which was passed by parliament after the last election and enabled us to leave the EU on the 31st of January this year, and not the trade deal that is currently being negotiated?
It was frustrating listening to Starmer confusing the two yesterday which suggested he is either poorly informed or dishonest.
Right, I’ll start with the disclaimer that Johnson is a liar and a charlatan, a c*nt, the current government is a shambles etc, etc, but are you aware that his “oven ready deal” was the withdrawal agreement, which was passed by parliament after the last election and enabled us to leave the EU on the 31st of January this year, and not the trade deal that is currently being negotiated?
It was frustrating listening to Starmer confusing the two yesterday which suggested he is either poorly informed or dishonest.
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 7:40]
This seems to have become a bit of a thing. The other day I read Michael Deacon in the Telegraph making your point, while John Grace made Ryorry's in the Guardian, both in crowing terms. Who's actually right?!
Has anyone ever looked at their own postings for last day or so? Oh my... so sorry. Was Ullaa
This seems to have become a bit of a thing. The other day I read Michael Deacon in the Telegraph making your point, while John Grace made Ryorry's in the Guardian, both in crowing terms. Who's actually right?!
It’s the deal he tried to rewrite and break international laws over until he bottled it a couple of days ago.
Right, I’ll start with the disclaimer that Johnson is a liar and a charlatan, a c*nt, the current government is a shambles etc, etc, but are you aware that his “oven ready deal” was the withdrawal agreement, which was passed by parliament after the last election and enabled us to leave the EU on the 31st of January this year, and not the trade deal that is currently being negotiated?
It was frustrating listening to Starmer confusing the two yesterday which suggested he is either poorly informed or dishonest.
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 7:40]
The equivocation over what was meant was a key part of the Tory GE campaign, Glassers. Let's not pretend they were explicit at the time that they really only meant the Withdrawal Agreement, which isn't really a deal at all. There was a lot of talk about free trade around the idea of an "oven-ready deal" and even more talk about "getting Brexit done". They were selling the voters a quick Brexit based on free trade. Let's not pretend otherwise now because it's politically expedient. This all feels rather like the backtracking Vote Leave did on most of their campaign slogans and pledges after they actually went and won the referendum.
The equivocation over what was meant was a key part of the Tory GE campaign, Glassers. Let's not pretend they were explicit at the time that they really only meant the Withdrawal Agreement, which isn't really a deal at all. There was a lot of talk about free trade around the idea of an "oven-ready deal" and even more talk about "getting Brexit done". They were selling the voters a quick Brexit based on free trade. Let's not pretend otherwise now because it's politically expedient. This all feels rather like the backtracking Vote Leave did on most of their campaign slogans and pledges after they actually went and won the referendum.
Did you believe the oven ready ready deal was a trade deal or the withdrawal agreement?
And like it or not he did get brexit done. We’ve left.
Look I’m not goung into bat for Johnson on this. It’s a waste of my time and I have no wish it did so. But it’s a fact that the oven ready deal was the WA, sketching May failed to get through at three attempts. Although most people wish she had now as it would have kept us in the single market.
Did you believe the oven ready ready deal was a trade deal or the withdrawal agreement?
And like it or not he did get brexit done. We’ve left.
Look I’m not goung into bat for Johnson on this. It’s a waste of my time and I have no wish it did so. But it’s a fact that the oven ready deal was the WA, sketching May failed to get through at three attempts. Although most people wish she had now as it would have kept us in the single market.
Not wasting any more time on this one.
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 8:11]
I've learnt to treat anything the Tories say as a kind of malevolent background noise.
Right, I’ll start with the disclaimer that Johnson is a liar and a charlatan, a c*nt, the current government is a shambles etc, etc, but are you aware that his “oven ready deal” was the withdrawal agreement, which was passed by parliament after the last election and enabled us to leave the EU on the 31st of January this year, and not the trade deal that is currently being negotiated?
It was frustrating listening to Starmer confusing the two yesterday which suggested he is either poorly informed or dishonest.
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 7:40]
The only person being dishonest here is Johnson, it was clear that the 'oven ready deal' was the trade deal as well, the fact the Tories have only started rebutting this in the last week is clear evidence of that.
Just like the bus at brexit - there is a touch of deniability in there but none of it is plausible
Right, I’ll start with the disclaimer that Johnson is a liar and a charlatan, a c*nt, the current government is a shambles etc, etc, but are you aware that his “oven ready deal” was the withdrawal agreement, which was passed by parliament after the last election and enabled us to leave the EU on the 31st of January this year, and not the trade deal that is currently being negotiated?
It was frustrating listening to Starmer confusing the two yesterday which suggested he is either poorly informed or dishonest.
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 7:40]
"What I think businesses large and small want to see is certainty about the arrangements we can deliver.
"And the thing about the deal we've got ready-to-go is it does protect the supply chains, it keeps them intact, it makes sure we have complete equivalence when it comes to our standards, our industrial requirements and all the rest of it.
Did you believe the oven ready ready deal was a trade deal or the withdrawal agreement?
And like it or not he did get brexit done. We’ve left.
Look I’m not goung into bat for Johnson on this. It’s a waste of my time and I have no wish it did so. But it’s a fact that the oven ready deal was the WA, sketching May failed to get through at three attempts. Although most people wish she had now as it would have kept us in the single market.
Not wasting any more time on this one.
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 8:11]
The "over ready deal" was clearly supposed to be a trade agreement. I don't think there is much evidence to try and argue it was the withdrawal agreement. I wouldn't even classify that as a deal, it was just something that had to happen.
I think there is still a decent chance of a deal, some of the sticking points are ridiculous and jingoistic. Fishing accounts for basically none of our GDP, less than the manufacture of doors and windows or lawnmowers yet it's a sticking point out of some misguided sense of nationalistic pride.
It's absolute folly to not get a deal due to something so insignificant that we probably don't have the resources to police anyway.
The "over ready deal" was clearly supposed to be a trade agreement. I don't think there is much evidence to try and argue it was the withdrawal agreement. I wouldn't even classify that as a deal, it was just something that had to happen.
I think there is still a decent chance of a deal, some of the sticking points are ridiculous and jingoistic. Fishing accounts for basically none of our GDP, less than the manufacture of doors and windows or lawnmowers yet it's a sticking point out of some misguided sense of nationalistic pride.
It's absolute folly to not get a deal due to something so insignificant that we probably don't have the resources to police anyway.
SB
Even if we were to concede that the "oven ready deal" was for the withdrawal agreements, there must be so many quotes about how easy and simple it would be to get a deal.
Right, I’ll start with the disclaimer that Johnson is a liar and a charlatan, a c*nt, the current government is a shambles etc, etc, but are you aware that his “oven ready deal” was the withdrawal agreement, which was passed by parliament after the last election and enabled us to leave the EU on the 31st of January this year, and not the trade deal that is currently being negotiated?
It was frustrating listening to Starmer confusing the two yesterday which suggested he is either poorly informed or dishonest.
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 7:40]
They also promised a free trade deal though, which they haven't yet secured. And of course their blurring of the lines is disinegous and that's before we even get to the promises during the 2016 campaign - as I say, if they thought people would vote for no deal in the referendum or election then they'd have campaigned on it.
Polling here suggests that almost two thirds of Tory voters believe it is important to get a trade deal, so whichever way they spin it they're currently failing.
Tory MPs are a LOT more willing to risk no-deal than Tory voters are. 63% of Tory voters think it is important to secure a trade deal with the EU, as do 60% of Leave voters. Only 27% of both groups think a deal is not important pic.twitter.com/6xS7hiUFFN
— Matt Dean is feeling festive🎄 (@Matt_Dean1994) December 10, 2020
Right, I’ll start with the disclaimer that Johnson is a liar and a charlatan, a c*nt, the current government is a shambles etc, etc, but are you aware that his “oven ready deal” was the withdrawal agreement, which was passed by parliament after the last election and enabled us to leave the EU on the 31st of January this year, and not the trade deal that is currently being negotiated?
It was frustrating listening to Starmer confusing the two yesterday which suggested he is either poorly informed or dishonest.
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 7:40]
Talking of poorly informed.
This is embarrassing. And for any of Boris predecessors would have been a serious issue. https://t.co/C8A7M4ulfu
I thought I'd misheard what was asked so I've now watched that clip twice, only to realise that Boris either had no idea what he was talking about or completely misheard the question.
Oh and this is yet another reason why there should be right to have follow up questions.
Even if we were to concede that the "oven ready deal" was for the withdrawal agreements, there must be so many quotes about how easy and simple it would be to get a deal.
The oven ready deal was the WA.
However the trade deal has been guaranteed by pretty much everyone who banged the drum for brexit until relatively recently when Australian style relationship entered the lexicon.
Anyone who disagreed was part of project fear. It’s no wonder fewer of them wish to engage now.
I can never fully work out what I think of Hodges. He comes out with some sensible stuff but then equally delivers some ridiculous takes such as defending Cummings' trip to Barnard Castle or saying that if a BAME Labour Home Sec had been found to have bullied staff, the party would have dismissed those criticisng them as racist.
I can never fully work out what I think of Hodges. He comes out with some sensible stuff but then equally delivers some ridiculous takes such as defending Cummings' trip to Barnard Castle or saying that if a BAME Labour Home Sec had been found to have bullied staff, the party would have dismissed those criticisng them as racist.
Yep, considering he had to run down Oxford Street in his Boxers because one of his many predictions was wrong, sums him up, however on this particular point he is correct.
Right, I’ll start with the disclaimer that Johnson is a liar and a charlatan, a c*nt, the current government is a shambles etc, etc, but are you aware that his “oven ready deal” was the withdrawal agreement, which was passed by parliament after the last election and enabled us to leave the EU on the 31st of January this year, and not the trade deal that is currently being negotiated?
It was frustrating listening to Starmer confusing the two yesterday which suggested he is either poorly informed or dishonest.
"What I think businesses large and small want to see is certainty about the arrangements we can deliver.
"And the thing about the deal we've got ready-to-go is it does protect the supply chains, it keeps them intact, it makes sure we have complete equivalence when it comes to our standards, our industrial requirements and all the rest of it.
"So as we come out, it's all protected."
Boris Johnson, 2019.
Yes, those level playing conditions were one of the key points in the WA that they've spent the year trying to get out of and are still one of the main 3 sticking points. They behaved the same with the Irish border problem too, but I think that was resolved a few weeks ago and we've finally agreed to honour what we said we'd do in the WA>
It's classic obfuscation from this shameless government. Get everyone arguing over the meaning of meaningless catchphrase, rather than looking at the content. It's like being governed by 6 year olds (possibly harsh on 6 year olds).
Yes, those level playing conditions were one of the key points in the WA that they've spent the year trying to get out of and are still one of the main 3 sticking points. They behaved the same with the Irish border problem too, but I think that was resolved a few weeks ago and we've finally agreed to honour what we said we'd do in the WA>
It's classic obfuscation from this shameless government. Get everyone arguing over the meaning of meaningless catchphrase, rather than looking at the content. It's like being governed by 6 year olds (possibly harsh on 6 year olds).
They have been sticking points since the result of the referendum was known. The EU for ages refused to enter into meaningful trade talks until they were resolved.
But as far as oven ready is concerned we left the EU almost a year ago.
Right, I’ll start with the disclaimer that Johnson is a liar and a charlatan, a c*nt, the current government is a shambles etc, etc, but are you aware that his “oven ready deal” was the withdrawal agreement, which was passed by parliament after the last election and enabled us to leave the EU on the 31st of January this year, and not the trade deal that is currently being negotiated?
It was frustrating listening to Starmer confusing the two yesterday which suggested he is either poorly informed or dishonest.
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 7:40]
I would suggest it is you who is either poorly informed or dishonest. And given the track record of you both the clip below will remove any doubt on that matter
" Speaking at a Nissan factory in the North East of England alongside former Labour MP Gisela Stuart, he said: "It's absolutely vital we protect supply chains, we protect Nissan motors, and we make sure people continue to invest in our country. And they will.
"What I think businesses large and small want to see is certainty about the arrangements we can deliver.
"And the thing about the deal we've got ready-to-go is it does protect the supply chains, it keeps them intact, it makes sure we have complete equivalence when it comes to our standards, our industrial requirements and all the rest of it.
I would suggest it is you who is either poorly informed or dishonest. And given the track record of you both the clip below will remove any doubt on that matter
" Speaking at a Nissan factory in the North East of England alongside former Labour MP Gisela Stuart, he said: "It's absolutely vital we protect supply chains, we protect Nissan motors, and we make sure people continue to invest in our country. And they will.
"What I think businesses large and small want to see is certainty about the arrangements we can deliver.
"And the thing about the deal we've got ready-to-go is it does protect the supply chains, it keeps them intact, it makes sure we have complete equivalence when it comes to our standards, our industrial requirements and all the rest of it.
"So as we come out, it's all protected."
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 11:25]
Hence why he's dashed over there at the last minute, as he realises what a complete clusterfcuk is about to hit us.
Right, I’ll start with the disclaimer that Johnson is a liar and a charlatan, a c*nt, the current government is a shambles etc, etc, but are you aware that his “oven ready deal” was the withdrawal agreement, which was passed by parliament after the last election and enabled us to leave the EU on the 31st of January this year, and not the trade deal that is currently being negotiated?
It was frustrating listening to Starmer confusing the two yesterday which suggested he is either poorly informed or dishonest.
[Post edited 10 Dec 2020 7:40]
I think you are technically correct. However, I'm also pretty sure he said previously that the chances of not getting a trade deal were 1 million to one.
The backlog of lies and embellishment is getting so strong that he may have to release a sort of greatest hits of lies.
I think you are technically correct. However, I'm also pretty sure he said previously that the chances of not getting a trade deal were 1 million to one.
The backlog of lies and embellishment is getting so strong that he may have to release a sort of greatest hits of lies.
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