| omg emily thornberry just said 23:27 - Sep 5 with 22886 views | Trequartista |
If labour win an election they will negotiate a new deal with the eu and then have a referendum and campaign against the deal they have negiotiated.
Now i know the twtd bubble is only concerned with booting johnson but back in the real world the weakest most chaotic government in history is about 8 points clear of labour. And with statements like the aforementioned how can they expect anyone to vote for that? |  |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:05 - Sep 6 with 2832 views | StokieBlue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 10:37 - Sep 6 by BrixtonBlue |
It really feels like you didn't read it very closely. I'm not going back through the whole article again, but just a quick return and I've pulled this quote;
"figures such as Dr James Sloan at Royal Holloway University argue that, beyond the issue of electoral turnout, there was a step-change in youth political participation, as young people were attracted in large numbers to Jeremy Corbyn’s message."
You can't get any more unequivocal than that.
The European elections feel like a distant memory after all that's gone on. Hundreds of thousands have registered to vote since then as well.
Polls have been notoriously unreliable in recent years anyway, without even factoring all these new, mostly young, voters joining in. |
You might have read it closely but seen what you wanted to see?
But his whole argument is based on the previous GE - things have moved on since then as more recent elections have shown. So I would argue you certainly take that position with a pinch of salt given the EU election results and the polling results GB posted.
"The European elections feel like a distant memory after all that's gone on."
How can you say the polls from a GE 3 years ago are valid but polls from this year are a distant memory - that's cherry picking.
"Polls have been notoriously unreliable in recent years anyway, "
These aren't "polls" as in theoretical - they are actual election results. You can't also claim all the youth vote when it clearly left Labour for the Lib Dems in the last actual election - it's once again cherry picking.
We won't have to wait long to find out - it's entirely possible that Labour will reclaim the youth vote but it will depend entirely on their position.
SB [Post edited 6 Sep 2019 13:06]
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:32 - Sep 6 with 2800 views | Swansea_Blue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 10:37 - Sep 6 by BrixtonBlue |
It really feels like you didn't read it very closely. I'm not going back through the whole article again, but just a quick return and I've pulled this quote;
"figures such as Dr James Sloan at Royal Holloway University argue that, beyond the issue of electoral turnout, there was a step-change in youth political participation, as young people were attracted in large numbers to Jeremy Corbyn’s message."
You can't get any more unequivocal than that.
The European elections feel like a distant memory after all that's gone on. Hundreds of thousands have registered to vote since then as well.
Polls have been notoriously unreliable in recent years anyway, without even factoring all these new, mostly young, voters joining in. |
I don't know what any movement in the young vote has been recently, but it seems the Tories are worried about the young vote. Which is why they've thinking about how best to restrict the student vote now - https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/general-election-date-aimed-to-restrict-stude |  |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:39 - Sep 6 with 2785 views | BrixtonBlue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 12:17 - Sep 6 by GlasgowBlue |
This could be a good indicator of where the pro EU labour vote is going
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Not really, it's a tiny ward in Coventry (it only gets one mention on Coventry's wiki page) which UKIP and the Greens didn't even bother standing for.
It's up there with the '3 young people' poll posted earlier in terms of significance. |  |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:50 - Sep 6 with 2774 views | BrixtonBlue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:05 - Sep 6 by StokieBlue |
You might have read it closely but seen what you wanted to see?
But his whole argument is based on the previous GE - things have moved on since then as more recent elections have shown. So I would argue you certainly take that position with a pinch of salt given the EU election results and the polling results GB posted.
"The European elections feel like a distant memory after all that's gone on."
How can you say the polls from a GE 3 years ago are valid but polls from this year are a distant memory - that's cherry picking.
"Polls have been notoriously unreliable in recent years anyway, "
These aren't "polls" as in theoretical - they are actual election results. You can't also claim all the youth vote when it clearly left Labour for the Lib Dems in the last actual election - it's once again cherry picking.
We won't have to wait long to find out - it's entirely possible that Labour will reclaim the youth vote but it will depend entirely on their position.
SB [Post edited 6 Sep 2019 13:06]
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You're the one who is cherrypicking. For starters, at the start of the thread I cited the article as another reason why polls can largely be ignored.
It was you who described the Euro results as a poll, I was just following you description.
I haven't based ANYTHING on polls from an election 3 years ago. As I keep saying, I hold no truck with polls. I, and the article, am/is talking about young people signing up to vote in their hundreds of thousand right now, and how the Labour party are looking at ways to capture their votes (like they did so successfully at the last election) and how experts in the article talk about Labour being traditionally adept at benefitting from these signup spikes.
As I stated above, the result GB posted for a tiny ward in Coventry doesn't have a great deal of significance. No doubt the Lib Dems will make big gains at the next election but this is scant evidence for them so far. | |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:52 - Sep 6 with 2773 views | BrixtonBlue |
Indeed. More dishonest, dirty tricks. Disgusting. | |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:54 - Sep 6 with 2769 views | Guthrum |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 11:32 - Sep 6 by Bluedandy |
I think we have been through a period when too many people have been given to understand that when they have a problem it is government’s job to cope with it. ‘I have a problem, I’ll get a grant. I’m homeless, the government must house me.’ They are casting their problems on society. And, you know, there is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women and there are families. And no governments can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first. It is our duty to look after ourselves and then, also, to look after our neighbours. People have got their entitlements too much in mind, without the obligations. There is no such thing as an entitlement, unless someone has first met an obligation. |
Ten to twelve thousand years of human civilisation, of putting society above the individual, discarded because someone wants to keep the small pile of money they made - as part of and under the protection of society.
Oh well, back to individualist hunter-gathering we go. |  |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:57 - Sep 6 with 2756 views | brazil1982 |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:52 - Sep 6 by BrixtonBlue |
Indeed. More dishonest, dirty tricks. Disgusting. |
May stop some double votes though. |  | | |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:58 - Sep 6 with 2754 views | BrixtonBlue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:57 - Sep 6 by brazil1982 |
May stop some double votes though. |
Double votes? | |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 14:00 - Sep 6 with 2752 views | GlasgowBlue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:39 - Sep 6 by BrixtonBlue |
Not really, it's a tiny ward in Coventry (it only gets one mention on Coventry's wiki page) which UKIP and the Greens didn't even bother standing for.
It's up there with the '3 young people' poll posted earlier in terms of significance. |
But if you look at the percentage Labour is down and the percentage the Lib Dems are up, it's damn near identical.
Another result from last night.
Labour just hold on. Labour vote down 20%, Lib Dems up 30%. |  |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 14:02 - Sep 6 with 2748 views | m14_blue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 11:32 - Sep 6 by Bluedandy |
I think we have been through a period when too many people have been given to understand that when they have a problem it is government’s job to cope with it. ‘I have a problem, I’ll get a grant. I’m homeless, the government must house me.’ They are casting their problems on society. And, you know, there is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women and there are families. And no governments can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first. It is our duty to look after ourselves and then, also, to look after our neighbours. People have got their entitlements too much in mind, without the obligations. There is no such thing as an entitlement, unless someone has first met an obligation. |
I think that be the single most depressing thing I've ever read on TWTD.
Including some of last season's match reports...... | | | |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 14:03 - Sep 6 with 2745 views | StokieBlue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:50 - Sep 6 by BrixtonBlue |
You're the one who is cherrypicking. For starters, at the start of the thread I cited the article as another reason why polls can largely be ignored.
It was you who described the Euro results as a poll, I was just following you description.
I haven't based ANYTHING on polls from an election 3 years ago. As I keep saying, I hold no truck with polls. I, and the article, am/is talking about young people signing up to vote in their hundreds of thousand right now, and how the Labour party are looking at ways to capture their votes (like they did so successfully at the last election) and how experts in the article talk about Labour being traditionally adept at benefitting from these signup spikes.
As I stated above, the result GB posted for a tiny ward in Coventry doesn't have a great deal of significance. No doubt the Lib Dems will make big gains at the next election but this is scant evidence for them so far. |
The only evidence we have of recent voting shows the Lib Dems taking large number of young voters from Labour. Anything else is speculation or even worse a conclusion based on historical trends which given recent times we know to be very fallible.
You may turn out to be entirely right as I said. We will know soon as it's not going to be long until a GE now. It will depend where Labour position themselves. They certainly won't be voting for the Tories though.
SB | |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 14:05 - Sep 6 with 2740 views | SpruceMoose |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 12:40 - Sep 6 by footers |
Weird how on the one hand people are burdening society with their homelessness and on the other it doesn't exist.
Cosmic. |
Funny how it's all about the individual until they themselves need assistance.
Talk about a case of Ayn Randitis. [Post edited 6 Sep 2019 14:05]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 14:42 - Sep 6 with 2720 views | flimflam |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 09:03 - Sep 6 by lowhouseblue |
possibly. and then what happens? |
The Tories will win and repeal everything and with a majority of MP's all onside do what they are trying to do now and leave with or without a deal. |  |
| All men and women are created, by the, you know the, you know the thing. |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 14:43 - Sep 6 with 2715 views | SpruceMoose |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 14:42 - Sep 6 by flimflam |
The Tories will win and repeal everything and with a majority of MP's all onside do what they are trying to do now and leave with or without a deal. |
You know, it really is true that the eyes are useless when the mind is blind. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 15:04 - Sep 6 with 2693 views | J2BLUE |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 11:32 - Sep 6 by Bluedandy |
I think we have been through a period when too many people have been given to understand that when they have a problem it is government’s job to cope with it. ‘I have a problem, I’ll get a grant. I’m homeless, the government must house me.’ They are casting their problems on society. And, you know, there is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women and there are families. And no governments can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first. It is our duty to look after ourselves and then, also, to look after our neighbours. People have got their entitlements too much in mind, without the obligations. There is no such thing as an entitlement, unless someone has first met an obligation. |
I knew I had seen this before. This is a quote by Margaret Thatcher in 1987. |  |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 15:29 - Sep 6 with 2676 views | brazil1982 |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:58 - Sep 6 by BrixtonBlue |
Double votes? |
Yes; students being able to vote in their "home" constituency and their "new" constituency. It's been done, but I don't know about the numbers. | | | |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 16:16 - Sep 6 with 2657 views | jas0999 |
Quite. Corbyn wouldn’t vote for a deal. He wouldn’t vote for no deal. He won’t vote for an election, despite demanding one for months. It’s a joke. | | | |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 16:16 - Sep 6 with 2653 views | jas0999 |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 23:58 - Sep 5 by Vaughan8 |
Yes she did    
These two parties are so bad. Who would want to vote for either. |
Exactly the position I find myself in. Won’t vote for either. | | | |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 16:22 - Sep 6 with 2643 views | Darth_Koont |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 16:16 - Sep 6 by jas0999 |
Quite. Corbyn wouldn’t vote for a deal. He wouldn’t vote for no deal. He won’t vote for an election, despite demanding one for months. It’s a joke. |
Because ensuring no deal is completely off the table for the foreseeable is much more important than getting a quick election. That will come soon enough. |  |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 16:37 - Sep 6 with 2629 views | J2BLUE |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 16:16 - Sep 6 by jas0999 |
Quite. Corbyn wouldn’t vote for a deal. He wouldn’t vote for no deal. He won’t vote for an election, despite demanding one for months. It’s a joke. |
How are you falling for this nonsense? He won't vote for an election because the government are trying to bait him into it so they can leave with no deal. | |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 16:45 - Sep 6 with 2617 views | BrixtonBlue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 14:00 - Sep 6 by GlasgowBlue |
But if you look at the percentage Labour is down and the percentage the Lib Dems are up, it's damn near identical.
Another result from last night.
Labour just hold on. Labour vote down 20%, Lib Dems up 30%. |
I mean, yeah, in those two small areas the Lib Dems took some of the Labour vote. Well done them.
A General Election across the whole country is a very different kettle of pyjamas. | |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 16:49 - Sep 6 with 2613 views | BrixtonBlue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 14:03 - Sep 6 by StokieBlue |
The only evidence we have of recent voting shows the Lib Dems taking large number of young voters from Labour. Anything else is speculation or even worse a conclusion based on historical trends which given recent times we know to be very fallible.
You may turn out to be entirely right as I said. We will know soon as it's not going to be long until a GE now. It will depend where Labour position themselves. They certainly won't be voting for the Tories though.
SB |
Why does recent voting show the Lib Dems taking large number of YOUNG voters from Labour? | |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 16:51 - Sep 6 with 2609 views | BrixtonBlue |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 15:29 - Sep 6 by brazil1982 |
Yes; students being able to vote in their "home" constituency and their "new" constituency. It's been done, but I don't know about the numbers. |
Is that enough of a reason to engineer an election when the least amount of young people can vote? | |
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| omg emily thornberry just said on 17:39 - Sep 6 with 2580 views | Bluedandy |
| omg emily thornberry just said on 13:54 - Sep 6 by Guthrum |
Ten to twelve thousand years of human civilisation, of putting society above the individual, discarded because someone wants to keep the small pile of money they made - as part of and under the protection of society.
Oh well, back to individualist hunter-gathering we go. |
Quite the reverse ... hunter- gatherers operated as primitive small-scale collectives for thousands of years ... rampant individualism was despised ... you would have fitted right in. | | | |
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