| Tuanzebe discuss... 20:57 - Nov 29 with 8198 views | WicklowBlue |
Not knocking Wolfie, and Millwall are not pressing us anywhere near like West Brom were.
But so far Tuanzebe has been imperious, sharp passing, getting stuck in, some pinged long passes and some nice close touches and spins. |  | | |  |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 06:53 - Nov 30 with 2141 views | BigCommon |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 01:33 - Nov 30 by pointofblue |
Honest question, as I don’t think you’ve ever been a fan of Woolfenden. Do you think we should look to sell him on and bring someone else in? Apologies if I’m wrong but it’s always appeared to me that you think we could do and should do better (Tuanzebe aside). [Post edited 30 Nov 2023 1:42]
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I'm a big fan of Woolfy. But Axel is just a better player.. His pathway will tell you that.
Personally think that the "blue tinted specs" can cloud some people's judgement when talking about our Ipswich boys. And it can often make others feel that they are treading on egg shells, in such discussions .
I'd love to see half a dozen academy players at once in the first team. But , if another player is better. Then, naturally, they get the shirt.. Axel is ahead of Woolfy, Williams is ahead of Clarke, Taylor is ahead of Humphrey's and Burgess is ahead of Baggot... Assuming everyone is fit..That's just the way it is.
LW, is still a key player. Doubt Axel will be doing heavy blocks of games, Its good to have both available, especially with the fixture schedule up to New Year, though. |  | | |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 07:04 - Nov 30 with 2102 views | chicoazul |
We could have played Warky at the back last night and been fine, Milwall had nothing up front. He looked ok I suppose, but I want my Woolf back. |  |
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| Tuanzebe discuss... on 07:09 - Nov 30 with 2087 views | bluelagos |
Reminded me of a young Titus. Strong as fck and very assured.
Think he earned another run out soon, nice position for KM to have competition for places and to be able to rotate and or rest players too. |  |
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| Tuanzebe discuss... on 07:17 - Nov 30 with 2069 views | Kieran_Knows |
He played that game wearing his dressing gown and slippers whilst smoking a pipe.
Rolls Royce. |  |
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| Tuanzebe discuss... on 07:37 - Nov 30 with 2039 views | Jimmy86 |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 06:34 - Nov 30 by franz_tyson |
I do find so many go too much overboard with Wolfie. Often hear that he's a "Rolls Royce " defender. And that hes PL quality already. He's doing well, but he's still got a way to go. At times,for me, could be stronger and can switch off. Bit disrespectful to Burgess that so many felt he must make way for Tuanzebe. Both Wolfie and Burgess are doing well in an attack- minded team, but looking forward to what Tuanzebe may bring. Wolfie will get his chance again, but he's not a cert in the first eleven. |
I suggested pretty much the same after the Swansea match and was slated for it... Think the blue tinted specs are at play, regarding Woolfie... Thing for me, is a lot of people suggested it should be Burgess who makes way for Tuanzebe, it's been telling that it's indeed been Woolfie instead... For me Burgess is just as good on the ball as Woolfie, but is a slightly better defender... Against Swansea he made a great sliding, block tackle in our box, having made up some ground, that was just as important for a defender as it is for an attacker scoring at the other end |  | | |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 07:44 - Nov 30 with 2021 views | BseaBlue |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 07:17 - Nov 30 by Kieran_Knows |
He played that game wearing his dressing gown and slippers whilst smoking a pipe.
Rolls Royce. |
Well said. He made the game look easy which is always a sign of a good defender in my eyes.
His reading of the game is far superior to any other defender we have. |  | | |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 07:57 - Nov 30 with 1996 views | Herbivore |
This thread is very interesting. Lots of people claiming Tuanzebe is now clearly ahead of Woolf in the pecking order off the back of one good game against a Millwall side who offered almost nothing going forward and a pretty average game against Rotherham where he was at least partly responsible for their opening goal. The mistake against Swansea aside, Woolf has been excellent this season and amongst our best players. Of course Tuanzebe has excellent pedigree and if he stays fit and reaches close to his potential then we've got a real player on our hands, but let's not go overboard off the back of one good game. I suspect last night was another case of McKenna having a plan to get him minutes rather than signalling s changing of the guard. |  |
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| Tuanzebe discuss... on 08:05 - Nov 30 with 1974 views | cressi |
Why has Tuanzebe has played, at Manchester United, Aston villa and Napoli obviously a different gravy if not for injuries he probably would be higher up the pyramid. But if managed well and no more injuries than anybody else we may have a rough diamond on our hands who McKenna can polish up. | | | |
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| Top quality defender, as is Wolfenden on 08:06 - Nov 30 with 1971 views | Dyland |
Burgess played well last night too, except thought he was a little lackadaisical for the Millwall goal... but the whole defence seemed to switch off? It wasn't too annoying cos a comeback never felt on the cards. Not like Argyle e.g. (though we were good for those three points).
Millwall. Did they get their tactics wrong? No real press, and Morsy in particular had so much space. Were they doubling up on our 10s? If so, it didn't work did it. I couldn't work it out really, but I'm an unashamed know-nothing (or rather, not an expert like some pretend to be). Maybe we were simply better, man for man, and tactics wise?
Very nice to see Chappers and Broaders on fire, and Burns make such an impact. Hirst needs a goal imo, though as ever his work rate and all round play is such a nuisance and so important to our attacking play. A completely different scenario to WBA who gave our forward line absolutely fook all, and restricted us to hoping for cheap free kicks. I suppose Albion's defenders are much bigger and better than Millwall's, and it's as simple as that. |  |
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| "lightyears ahead of Woolfie" on 08:09 - Nov 30 with 1964 views | Dyland |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 00:23 - Nov 30 by ArnieM |
Axel is sheer quality and if he stays fit I can’t see him coming out if that defence anytime soon. He’s lightyears ahead of Woolfie I’m afraid. But McKenna knows that. |
Utter bobbins, and pretty disrespectful and unhelpful. Your comment is the keyboard equivalent of audibly groaning at Wolfenden when he plays. Not saying you do that ;) | |
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| rough diamond? on 08:25 - Nov 30 with 1921 views | Dyland |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 08:05 - Nov 30 by cressi |
Why has Tuanzebe has played, at Manchester United, Aston villa and Napoli obviously a different gravy if not for injuries he probably would be higher up the pyramid. But if managed well and no more injuries than anybody else we may have a rough diamond on our hands who McKenna can polish up. |
Not really. He's the real deal already, if he can get fully match fit and stay injury free. | |
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| Tuanzebe discuss... on 08:25 - Nov 30 with 1920 views | NthQldITFC |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 22:49 - Nov 29 by NthQldITFC |
He's class, but so is Woolfy, very similar players who make so much time for themselves with their positioning and reading and calmness. Axel may have a bit more pace and be a bit stronger, but there's not much in it. Woolfy not had the injuries. Both would be fine at a higher level.
Baggott looks like he's cut from similar cloth, and to be fair Burgess does these days too to a large extent. Remarkable improvement in Burgess, and he's also physically as strong as Tuanzebe or more so. We are very well stocked for centre backs.
Having said that we need a bit more authoritative communication and decision making at times, witness the goal against today where Burgess really should have cut it out. Don't know if Davis released him to go for it or not, but he certainly could have done. Not knocking him, he's been brilliant. |
This wasn't in any way meant to be in the slightest bit critical of Burgess, I think he is now and has for a year or so been excellent for us, and like many other players in the squad has been developed brilliantly (and that development is as much down to the players' attitudes and efforts as to the coaching).
With the addition of Tuanzebe, and what looks to me from a small but not tiny sample size to be an extremely promising Baggott, it's just that in my mind our central defensive unit as a whole has gone up a level in my estimation and expectation. It was already very high, but I now think it's very top end Championship and Premier League capable. That's not particularly about individuals adding more, but about the unit as a whole and not to forget Edmundson who can add to it too.
With that increased expectation on my part, I'd pick out one area for improvement (obviously from what I've said above, not at all with any negativity or criticism intended). That area would be ownership of the box towards the end of games. There's can be a tendency as a centre back towards the end of games to drop the bloke you're marking and go towards the goal line as a shot blocker when you're seeing a game out. I seem to remember Woolfy doing a similar thing (might have been against Plymouth) late in the game for an opposition consolation goal.
Like I say, not a criticism, but I'd be looking to tweak them to be a little more assertive and front foot in those situations going to the ball/space rather than dropping back on the block. It's very instinctive though so might be hard to achieve, perhaps Hladky can make them a touch more decisive there by barking at them in those situations? |  |
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| Top quality defender, as is Wolfenden on 08:28 - Nov 30 with 1903 views | BtreeBlueBlood |
| Top quality defender, as is Wolfenden on 08:06 - Nov 30 by Dyland |
Burgess played well last night too, except thought he was a little lackadaisical for the Millwall goal... but the whole defence seemed to switch off? It wasn't too annoying cos a comeback never felt on the cards. Not like Argyle e.g. (though we were good for those three points).
Millwall. Did they get their tactics wrong? No real press, and Morsy in particular had so much space. Were they doubling up on our 10s? If so, it didn't work did it. I couldn't work it out really, but I'm an unashamed know-nothing (or rather, not an expert like some pretend to be). Maybe we were simply better, man for man, and tactics wise?
Very nice to see Chappers and Broaders on fire, and Burns make such an impact. Hirst needs a goal imo, though as ever his work rate and all round play is such a nuisance and so important to our attacking play. A completely different scenario to WBA who gave our forward line absolutely fook all, and restricted us to hoping for cheap free kicks. I suppose Albion's defenders are much bigger and better than Millwall's, and it's as simple as that. |
Millwall, obviously didn’t want to play the high press as so many other sides have done and lost.
So tried something different, not a low block.
Unfortunately, for them, they got ripped apart within three minutes in the game, was it probably over after 10?
With Axel and Wolfie both being right-sided centre backs I do kind of worry for January when we lose both Burgess and Baggett to competition with their countries. |  | | |
| Hmmmm on 08:28 - Nov 30 with 1904 views | Dyland |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 07:37 - Nov 30 by Jimmy86 |
I suggested pretty much the same after the Swansea match and was slated for it... Think the blue tinted specs are at play, regarding Woolfie... Thing for me, is a lot of people suggested it should be Burgess who makes way for Tuanzebe, it's been telling that it's indeed been Woolfie instead... For me Burgess is just as good on the ball as Woolfie, but is a slightly better defender... Against Swansea he made a great sliding, block tackle in our box, having made up some ground, that was just as important for a defender as it is for an attacker scoring at the other end |
The notion that "Burgess is just as good on the ball as Woolfie" isn't borne out by reality though.
It's also true that Burgess is not at all bad on the ball, and that he's vastly improved (maybe the most improved of all our players under McKenna?). His touch coming through the middle in the lead up to the third goal was lovely. Well, I think it was him! | |
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| Tuanzebe discuss... on 08:29 - Nov 30 with 1902 views | SheffordBlue |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 21:01 - Nov 29 by Swansea_Blue |
I thought his passing can be a bit suspect at time. His technique is good, but he’s played at few hospital balls that result in turnovers and put us under pressure. That’ll come though.
Overall he’s looking solid and composed. You can see his pedigree. |
He completed 93% of his passes last night. A couple of the uncompleted passes were where he played it in front of player expecting them to run onto it and they didn't. I think there was something similar with Williams when he first started for us and maybe indicates a different expectation of what the receiving player is likely to do. | |
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| Tuanzebe discuss... on 08:37 - Nov 30 with 1873 views | Lord_Lucan |
I was saying to my mates yesterday that if we can keep him fit he is the equivalent to a big money signing.
Also I think Scarlet will come good - very good - with more minutes played.
What a difference a few days make. |  |
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| Scarlet is looking sharper with every run out on 08:42 - Nov 30 with 1843 views | Dyland |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 08:37 - Nov 30 by Lord_Lucan |
I was saying to my mates yesterday that if we can keep him fit he is the equivalent to a big money signing.
Also I think Scarlet will come good - very good - with more minutes played.
What a difference a few days make. |
Could he begin to fulfill his potential here this season? It's not such a crazy wish, and if he does he will make a massive difference. Thought he should have come on ten minutes earlier against WBA, as we were getting zilch. | |
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| Scarlet is looking sharper with every run out on 08:45 - Nov 30 with 1834 views | SheffordBlue |
| Scarlet is looking sharper with every run out on 08:42 - Nov 30 by Dyland |
Could he begin to fulfill his potential here this season? It's not such a crazy wish, and if he does he will make a massive difference. Thought he should have come on ten minutes earlier against WBA, as we were getting zilch. |
Thought he could have come on 10 minutes earlier last night and had a bit of time with the 'starting' forward line before Chappers, Broadhead, Burns were replaced. It took a top draw save from Bart to deny him his first goal for us last night. | |
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| Agreed on 08:46 - Nov 30 with 1832 views | Dyland |
| Scarlet is looking sharper with every run out on 08:45 - Nov 30 by SheffordBlue |
Thought he could have come on 10 minutes earlier last night and had a bit of time with the 'starting' forward line before Chappers, Broadhead, Burns were replaced. It took a top draw save from Bart to deny him his first goal for us last night. |
Needs minutes in the boots innit. | |
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| Tuanzebe discuss... on 08:46 - Nov 30 with 1824 views | itfcjoe |
I thought it was a pretty easy game for him as Millwall offered basically zero, but getting a player of his pedigree up to fitness is going to be massive for us because ultimately if he can play to his potential he is our best defender - I can't say that across Rotherham and Millwall games I've seen it all yet and look forward to when he is tested more as sure he'll step up.
Burgess and Woolfenden have been fantastic, if he can displace one of them then we are in a great position with 3 high quality CBs |  |
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| Tuanzebe discuss... on 08:47 - Nov 30 with 1806 views | farkenhell |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 08:37 - Nov 30 by Lord_Lucan |
I was saying to my mates yesterday that if we can keep him fit he is the equivalent to a big money signing.
Also I think Scarlet will come good - very good - with more minutes played.
What a difference a few days make. |
A real same Scarlet didn't score at the end. Would have done his confidence the world of good. | | | |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 09:08 - Nov 30 with 1740 views | Herbivore |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 08:37 - Nov 30 by Lord_Lucan |
I was saying to my mates yesterday that if we can keep him fit he is the equivalent to a big money signing.
Also I think Scarlet will come good - very good - with more minutes played.
What a difference a few days make. |
Agree on Scarlett, he's getting better and better in his cameos and thought he looked really lively last night, took a good reaction stop from Bart to keep him from getting his first goal for us. | |
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| Tuanzebe discuss... on 09:12 - Nov 30 with 1721 views | Freddies_Ears |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 21:01 - Nov 29 by Swansea_Blue |
I thought his passing can be a bit suspect at time. His technique is good, but he’s played at few hospital balls that result in turnovers and put us under pressure. That’ll come though.
Overall he’s looking solid and composed. You can see his pedigree. |
He pings a pass rather more sharply than Championship players are used to receiving. As a mate of mine calls it, he passes to his team-mates as if he hates them".
Class, class player, still feeling his way. | | | |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 09:20 - Nov 30 with 1679 views | BloomBlue |
Looked good but he won't get an easier game in the Championship this season. It would have interesting to see him against WBA.
But clearly KM is trying to get him match fit and sensibly selecting him for the easier games at first. |  | | |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 09:28 - Nov 30 with 1647 views | pointofblue |
| Tuanzebe discuss... on 09:20 - Nov 30 by BloomBlue |
Looked good but he won't get an easier game in the Championship this season. It would have interesting to see him against WBA.
But clearly KM is trying to get him match fit and sensibly selecting him for the easier games at first. |
Our defending as a team was pretty poor against West Brom. A lot of people point the finger at the defence but the forward line couldn't hold up the ball and the midfield were bypassed. Easier opposition meant more time for the attackers and an easier night for the midfield, which took pressure off the defence.
There were a couple of moments where they broke through and we looked shaky though, including the goal. | |
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