| Reform UK Manifesto 15:01 - Jun 17 with 11882 views | BlueNomad |
Reading it is more frightening and sinister than hearing the likes of Farage spouting off. Obviously immigration is their big thing but much of it is approaching National Socialism. |  | | |  |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:54 - Jun 17 with 2687 views | StokieBlue |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:27 - Jun 17 by Pencilpete |
Like I said - every single political party other than the SNP said on national TV that immigration numbers were too high
To answer the other question about how many migrants were dependents Nigel Farage said it was half but it was fact checked on TV and they said it was nearer 30% |
They said that because people like you believe it to be true and will take what they say into account when voting without looking at the evidence.
You've still not provided any evidence, that's an anecdotal reference at best.
It's a huge issue in politics across the world.
SB [Post edited 17 Jun 2024 18:54]
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:54 - Jun 17 with 2684 views | Keno |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 17:54 - Jun 17 by Pencilpete |
To answer everyone - it’s very clear migration is out of control every single party acknowledges this,from what I gather net migration is over half a million a year.
I don’t have a problem with migration, people come in and they do valuable jobs and contribute greatly, but at the end of the day we are an island and it simply isnt sustainable to have that many extra people year after year after year ….. and it’s true the increased population does put an extra strain on housing, the NHS etc …. That’s just logical.
I have always believed you should run the country like you run your house … don’t spend money you haven’t got ETC and in that sense if I kept letting people in the front door and only a few out of the back it won’t be long before there wasn’t any room, the utility bills went through the roof, hot water ran out and everyone in there was fed up and miserable and that’s what’s happening in this country.
I don’t want to put a stop to migration but it definitely needs to be brought under control otherwise the likes of Nigel Farage are going to get support |
And somewhat unbelievably there are a large number of people who having fallen for the EU lie and now falling for the immigrant lie. |  |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:57 - Jun 17 with 2676 views | Pencilpete |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:43 - Jun 17 by homer_123 |
Migration is much more a political issue for this Country.
A couple of points that I think are rather significant. Would you care to explain how migration has affected the 'water' situation in this country. We have a situation whereby privately owned water companies wish to increase costs by over 100% in some areas and yet the same privately owned companies have paid out nearly £90bn in dividends.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw4478wnjdpo
Migration and immigration has no bearing on something like this, a situation that affects every single person in this country.
You also seem not to mention what would happen to something like the NHS without people willing to relocate to this country and work within said institution.
By the by less than 10% of this island is actually developed. As of April 2022:
8.7% of land in England is of developed use, with 91.1% of non-developed use and the remaining 0.2% being vacant.
Not all land within the UK can be developed for obvious reasons but we hardly lack space - we may lack infrastructure but we lacked that for many, many years. |
I think you’ve mis interpreted what I was saying mate - I’m not at all blaming migrants for issues with water it was just part of my example of treating the country like a house -and I’ve said on several previous posts I’m not completely anti migration and totally agree the vast majority do contribute and fill important jobs. Just to be 100% clear ….
Do I think the numbers are too high ? Yes I do
Do I think there should be net zero migration like Nigel Farage ? No I don’t
My original point was if the leading parties had done more to control the immigration numbers then the likes of Nigel Farage would not be getting the level of support he is …. That’s all |  | | |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 19:02 - Jun 17 with 2648 views | homer_123 |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:57 - Jun 17 by Pencilpete |
I think you’ve mis interpreted what I was saying mate - I’m not at all blaming migrants for issues with water it was just part of my example of treating the country like a house -and I’ve said on several previous posts I’m not completely anti migration and totally agree the vast majority do contribute and fill important jobs. Just to be 100% clear ….
Do I think the numbers are too high ? Yes I do
Do I think there should be net zero migration like Nigel Farage ? No I don’t
My original point was if the leading parties had done more to control the immigration numbers then the likes of Nigel Farage would not be getting the level of support he is …. That’s all |
My observation is that migration isn't really a major issue in this Country - we have much bigger problems.
For example, the Water situation is one of them. |  |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 19:05 - Jun 17 with 2629 views | NedPlimpton |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 17:02 - Jun 17 by BlueForYou |
"Can I interest you in some snake oil, sir?"
Yes you could, problem is which bottle to buy? There's a blue one, a red one, a yellow one, a green one, & a turquoise one. It's like shopping with the wife at Tesco! They're all the same & never do what it says on the label..!! |
Weird that the 'they're all the same' argument is only ever trotted out by people wanting to vote for UKIP/Reform, but can't actually articulate why |  | | |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 19:08 - Jun 17 with 2619 views | Mullet |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:49 - Jun 17 by Pencilpete |
I’ll acknowledge there is no right or wrong answer because there are people who think 10,000 Immigrants a year is too many and others who think 6 million a year is fine - there isn’t a line drawn in the sand at a certain figure where everyone agrees so whatever my opinion is I’ll totally respect yours is different and there’s nothing wrong with that.
Obviously the fact people voted for Brexit and they’re now supporting Nigel Farage shows that a large number of people in the UK have a problem with the numbers as they are and on that basis my initial comment of “if the leading parties had controlled the numbers better then Nigel Farage wouldn’t be getting the support he is” stands to reason doesn’t it ?
Wether you agree with the numbers, think they’re too low or too high that’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it but the immigration numbers are going up year on year I don’t think there’s too much dispute over that and again the support Farage is getting would suggest again that a lot of people think it’s too high |
These people have a problem with their quality of life, cost of living and access to services being completely wrecked.
Theyre told it’s immigrants by people like Farage, who profits hand over fist from the current status quo. Then has the brass neck to claim he can fix it too.
It’s a tactic as old as the most ancient civilisations. People just want better and if they’re told these “boat people” are stopping them having it and the tweedy Sh1tler will fix it without them having to even think about it, they’ll go for it.
The 20th century is dogged by labour shortages, especially in the lowest paid sectors. The fact that Farage last big grift in Brexit has caused immigration to skyrocket is a bitter irony. May and her ilk constantly spreading dog whistle misinformation has a lot to answer for too. |  |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 19:15 - Jun 17 with 2610 views | BlueNomad |
“Left wing” and “pro-Palestine” protests marked out as needing to be stopped. They are violent apparently [Post edited 17 Jun 2024 19:17]
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 19:20 - Jun 17 with 2600 views | eireblue |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:57 - Jun 17 by Pencilpete |
I think you’ve mis interpreted what I was saying mate - I’m not at all blaming migrants for issues with water it was just part of my example of treating the country like a house -and I’ve said on several previous posts I’m not completely anti migration and totally agree the vast majority do contribute and fill important jobs. Just to be 100% clear ….
Do I think the numbers are too high ? Yes I do
Do I think there should be net zero migration like Nigel Farage ? No I don’t
My original point was if the leading parties had done more to control the immigration numbers then the likes of Nigel Farage would not be getting the level of support he is …. That’s all |
You are considering the wrong figures.
By the way using a house as a model for running a country is a bad idea.
But…
If you have a house with one baby, and 5 elderly people, that’s not as good as two babies, 4 working adults and 2 elderly people.
One of those houses is sustainable, the other is doomed.
Farage and others have been using very simple numbers, to describe a complex problem.
Another example, pre- Brexit, someone from the EU could pop over to the U.K. for 50 quid on Ryan Air, find some work, pop off back home whenever. See also U.K. people leaving to work in the EU. Free movement of labour.
Now we are open to the world and in charge of immigration, with no free movement, people won’t be popping over from Bolivia, they will be migrating and staying.
One leads to a different demographic outcome.
And it is demographics that are more important than a simple number.
At the moment the birth rate in the U.K. is about 1.6-ish children per women.
For a stable population it needs to be 2.1. |  | | |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 19:22 - Jun 17 with 2595 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
I think I read that the BofE is paying interest when it holds the free QE money tree money for high Street banks. Can anyone confirm if this is the case and equates to this...
'Reform said it planned to fund the cuts by raising £40bn from reducing the interest paid on Bank of England reserves.' |  |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 19:24 - Jun 17 with 2586 views | Clapham_Junction |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 17:54 - Jun 17 by Pencilpete |
To answer everyone - it’s very clear migration is out of control every single party acknowledges this,from what I gather net migration is over half a million a year.
I don’t have a problem with migration, people come in and they do valuable jobs and contribute greatly, but at the end of the day we are an island and it simply isnt sustainable to have that many extra people year after year after year ….. and it’s true the increased population does put an extra strain on housing, the NHS etc …. That’s just logical.
I have always believed you should run the country like you run your house … don’t spend money you haven’t got ETC and in that sense if I kept letting people in the front door and only a few out of the back it won’t be long before there wasn’t any room, the utility bills went through the roof, hot water ran out and everyone in there was fed up and miserable and that’s what’s happening in this country.
I don’t want to put a stop to migration but it definitely needs to be brought under control otherwise the likes of Nigel Farage are going to get support |
So I assume you saved up for a house, rather than getting a mortgage? |  | | |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 21:21 - Jun 17 with 2452 views | BlueForYou |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 19:05 - Jun 17 by NedPlimpton |
Weird that the 'they're all the same' argument is only ever trotted out by people wanting to vote for UKIP/Reform, but can't actually articulate why |
I'm not voting for anyone! |  | | |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 22:42 - Jun 17 with 2346 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 15:56 - Jun 17 by BlueForYou |
Watched it earlier. They stressed they don't expect to form a government, it is not a manifesto but more a document of guidance for the next five years. Some interesting ideas. Some include.....
Lower Tax threshold to £20k, Tigher Tax threshold to £70k.
VAT Threshold to £120k
Abolish IR35
Support small & medium Business
Scrap Police commisioners/Zero Tolerance Policing
Net Zero Immigration
NHS & Social Care staff to pay zero basic rate tax for three years
NHS Voucher Scheme
Reform House of Lords/PR voting
British Bill of Rights
Westminster Anti Corruption Unit
50% Public ownership of utily companies, other 50% UK pension funds
Quite a comprehensive document, & appears to be properly funded. Its very different from the other parties & can see it being quite poplular. |
Property funded!!
Ffs |  | | |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 22:44 - Jun 17 with 2340 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 16:45 - Jun 17 by BlueForYou |
I didn't make any claim. I said appears to be. Sky thought it was financially sound earlier but thought it would be a big ask, & the green manifesto was more expensive than Reform, their graph showed. Most costings for manifestos are based on a certain amount of guesswork & assumptions surely? Also it's a football forum not an exam paper! [Post edited 17 Jun 2024 16:48]
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Whatever you are taking must be good stuff | | | |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 06:37 - Jun 18 with 2236 views | IPS_wich |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 16:03 - Jun 17 by hype313 |
They don't need to worry though as they know they won't win, it's just empty rhetoric which the masses will lap up.
He shouldn't be anywhere near frontline politics, but he is due to the state of the Conservatives an Labour. Any halfwit could've nullified his threat early on, but they're too scared to take him on.
Bizarre. |
I don't wish to be too alarmist - but these sort of statements ('they know they won't win') were pretty prevalent until about 10 days before the Brexit vote, and we all know what happened.
Seems like Farage is blowing on the same dog whistle again knowing there is a large number of people who still believe in the argument for Brexit but are disappointed in the implementation. | | | |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 08:01 - Jun 18 with 2184 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:44 - Jun 17 by BABLUE |
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“He’s Liz Truss in human form” 
Nailed it again though. Farage is a dangerous populist grifter whose party would be a disaster if they hold any influence in the HoC. We’ve seen where vacuous populist ideas take us and it hasn’t been good. Time for some boring, old fashioned running the country for a while to try to repair the damage. |  |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 08:03 - Jun 18 with 2180 views | StokieBlue |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 06:37 - Jun 18 by IPS_wich |
I don't wish to be too alarmist - but these sort of statements ('they know they won't win') were pretty prevalent until about 10 days before the Brexit vote, and we all know what happened.
Seems like Farage is blowing on the same dog whistle again knowing there is a large number of people who still believe in the argument for Brexit but are disappointed in the implementation. |
The scenarios are totally different.
Brexit was a straight numbers vote, the GE is a constituency based vote to determine the MPs in the house.
It is correct to say they won't win so they can saw whatever they want.
SB | | | |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 08:12 - Jun 18 with 2167 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 19:22 - Jun 17 by BanksterDebtSlave |
I think I read that the BofE is paying interest when it holds the free QE money tree money for high Street banks. Can anyone confirm if this is the case and equates to this...
'Reform said it planned to fund the cuts by raising £40bn from reducing the interest paid on Bank of England reserves.' |
Anyone? | |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 08:18 - Jun 18 with 2128 views | GeoffSentence |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 16:08 - Jun 17 by BlueForYou |
Not sure anyone believes the costings of the other parties either to be fair. Again I suppose it depends on who you read. They all claim to be right. |
AHa, here it is, the old "they are all as bad as each other" argument. the argument of last resort. |  |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 08:43 - Jun 18 with 2060 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:16 - Jun 17 by Swansea_Blue |
“It’s clear that immigration is out of control”. How is it clear? |
"Because I saw it on a Daily Mail headline!" |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 08:56 - Jun 18 with 2019 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 18:49 - Jun 17 by Pencilpete |
I’ll acknowledge there is no right or wrong answer because there are people who think 10,000 Immigrants a year is too many and others who think 6 million a year is fine - there isn’t a line drawn in the sand at a certain figure where everyone agrees so whatever my opinion is I’ll totally respect yours is different and there’s nothing wrong with that.
Obviously the fact people voted for Brexit and they’re now supporting Nigel Farage shows that a large number of people in the UK have a problem with the numbers as they are and on that basis my initial comment of “if the leading parties had controlled the numbers better then Nigel Farage wouldn’t be getting the support he is” stands to reason doesn’t it ?
Wether you agree with the numbers, think they’re too low or too high that’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it but the immigration numbers are going up year on year I don’t think there’s too much dispute over that and again the support Farage is getting would suggest again that a lot of people think it’s too high |
"my initial comment of “if the leading parties had controlled the numbers better then Nigel Farage wouldn’t be getting the support he is” stands to reason doesn’t it ?"
No.
Labour haven't been in power for 14 years. Maybe you think they should've been fixing immigration while they had all that time on their hands. Lazy! | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 10:06 - Jun 18 with 1959 views | ElephantintheRoom |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 15:56 - Jun 17 by BlueForYou |
Watched it earlier. They stressed they don't expect to form a government, it is not a manifesto but more a document of guidance for the next five years. Some interesting ideas. Some include.....
Lower Tax threshold to £20k, Tigher Tax threshold to £70k.
VAT Threshold to £120k
Abolish IR35
Support small & medium Business
Scrap Police commisioners/Zero Tolerance Policing
Net Zero Immigration
NHS & Social Care staff to pay zero basic rate tax for three years
NHS Voucher Scheme
Reform House of Lords/PR voting
British Bill of Rights
Westminster Anti Corruption Unit
50% Public ownership of utily companies, other 50% UK pension funds
Quite a comprehensive document, & appears to be properly funded. Its very different from the other parties & can see it being quite poplular. |
Indeed. Not much there you could disagree with and if it was Labour the Guardian-reading infants on here would be all for it. | |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 10:13 - Jun 18 with 1936 views | BlueNomad |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 10:06 - Jun 18 by ElephantintheRoom |
Indeed. Not much there you could disagree with and if it was Labour the Guardian-reading infants on here would be all for it. |
They walk amongst us......................... | | | |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 10:19 - Jun 18 with 1923 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Reform UK Manifesto on 10:06 - Jun 18 by ElephantintheRoom |
Indeed. Not much there you could disagree with and if it was Labour the Guardian-reading infants on here would be all for it. |
Bit ironic you calling other people infants given your toys-out-of-the-pram posting on here for literally years. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Reform UK Manifesto on 13:07 - Jun 18 with 1827 views | FBI |
Here's a fun game: is this a quote from Oswald Mosley of the British Union of Fascists in 1939 or Nigel Farage of Reform in 2024?
Let us turn at long last in conclusion to have a look here at home at the open door. Not only are their goods coming in, but they are coming in themselves, thousands of them; thousands of them coming in, not only undermining our standard of life, not only debauching our commercial practices, not only swelling the practices of criminal lawyers, not only changing the commercial outlook and morality of the British to’ the detriment of our simple and honest people; not on IT, that, my friends; this policy of the open door, this universal entry of alien standards and alien life if permitted to continue, is going to change the whole character of English life and English people, and is to complete the work which a century of capitalist production began, uprooting the English from the soil of their own native land and changing forever the life of our people. |  |
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