| Even their own cheerleaders are turning.. on 22:06 - Apr 9 with 2200 views | xrayspecs |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning.. on 21:56 - Apr 9 by Trequartista |
I think i've worked it out, using your reasoning - thank you
"In England, 765 patients have died in England after contracting coronavirus - bringing the total to 7,248. The figures have been released by NHS England. They clarified that 140 of those deaths took place on Wednesday, while 568 happened within the previous week and the remaining 57 were from March."
So the daily total of reported deaths is 765 in the last 24 hours, which is comparable to the >800 from the day before, but today, for the first time, they've broken down those reported deaths into the actual death date to illustrate that for all the daily death totals we have been receiving, the day the person actually died was more often than not, before the day of reporting. |
I may be wrong but i believe they have been providing this granularity for a few days.
We have known for a few weeks that daily totals are not deaths in the last 24 hours.
I think, again may be wrong, is that it is worth mapping long term trends rather than looking at daily totals, as this will give us a better idea of where we are in the pandemic.
Key stats for me:
- how many hospital admissions
- how many ICU admissions
Both are predictors of infection rates and then deaths.
The hope is that social distancing (especially among those at most risk) will significantly reduce the above stats. |  | |  |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning.. on 22:29 - Apr 9 with 2173 views | Trequartista |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning.. on 22:06 - Apr 9 by xrayspecs |
I may be wrong but i believe they have been providing this granularity for a few days.
We have known for a few weeks that daily totals are not deaths in the last 24 hours.
I think, again may be wrong, is that it is worth mapping long term trends rather than looking at daily totals, as this will give us a better idea of where we are in the pandemic.
Key stats for me:
- how many hospital admissions
- how many ICU admissions
Both are predictors of infection rates and then deaths.
The hope is that social distancing (especially among those at most risk) will significantly reduce the above stats. |
I have only been following the headline figures announced in the afternoon via either sky news or bbc news, so although this granularity may have been available before, it is the first time it has been announced in the headline figures so that totally threw me - and i think it threw the media too as they originally only added 140 to the total death figure, and amended it when the uk totals were confirmed by the government later on. |  |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 22:33 - Apr 9 with 2167 views | Churchman |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 21:20 - Apr 9 by Freddies_Ears |
Guardian is running a story tonight that around 1,000 people have died so far in UK care homes. Story is based on the Care Homes umbrella organisation and the Alzheimers Society.
My mum is in a care home which is half regular cases, half dementia, and until yesterday carers had no additional PPE at all, and had not isolated residents from each other... |
My only experience of a care homes is Asterbury in Ipswich where my mum was. The staff were absolutely amazing and did their very best for her till the day she died. When there was flu virus or anything like that visitors were always banned for obvious reasons and I’ve no doubt they are now, tough though that is for relations. I do hope they’ve managed to get adequate PPE, but C-19 is so virulent it’s desperately hard to keep it out. While the staff themselves are going to be so vulnerable, I know how hard they will work to protect and look after their patients. Wonderful people.
As has been stated, people are not there because they are fit and well and while C-19 may be the thing that is the final straw for some, it may be only contributory to others. For example, an acquaintance of er indoors’ husband had a number of health problems and suffered heart attack at home, was fitting and in need of CPR. He sadly passed away in hospital. It was discovered that he also had the virus, so that will go somewhere on the death certificate and into the stats
I believe the stats are only useful as an indicator in trend analysis. |  | | |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 22:45 - Apr 9 with 2160 views | monytowbray |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 21:50 - Apr 9 by StokieBlue |
The bit where nobody stockpiled because it wasn't feasible to stockpile for a pandemic. It's too costly for everyone. Which country had adequate stockpiles of PPE?
The second point you didn't answer was how the government were supposed to get more now given there is a global shortage and the US are paying crazy sums?
You are deflecting by not answering, not me. You criticise constantly without acknowledging the difficulties of the situation. It seems the only thing getting your through it to direct your anger at the government at any and all subjects. That's fine but it's not reasonable.
SB |
Are you actually deflecting fair criticism of hindsight many were calling out at the time as “well what can they do now?” Because I’m not sure what point you are making.
We had weeks to prepare. I went into isolation personally 4 weeks ago today and I was wondering then how the NHS is going to cope with limited resources. Yet here we are. With nurses and carers at risk from a lack of protection, and an admitted risk of a shortage of ventilators. I watched us miss that EU deadline as it was over the news for a week we hadn’t responded. It was madness then, let alone in hindsight.
Not sure what more turns or lies this needs to take before you open your eyes and stop sitting on the fence about this sh1t show and arguing pedantics. [Post edited 9 Apr 2020 22:47]
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 22:50 - Apr 9 with 2162 views | factual_blue |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 20:36 - Apr 9 by xrayspecs |
The daily figures are not what people necessary assume.
- they are deaths reported in the last 24 hours rather than deaths in the last 24 hours
- a lot of folk who died were frail/unwell and had limited life expectancy
- some were dying and then caught Covid19 in hospital
- we have seen dips in the numbers over the weekend (non-reporting of cases) followed by a catch up in the following days
There is some debate about by how much the published figures underestimate the true figure as it is hospital deaths only. The emerging view is not by much as most folk, with the exception of those in care homes and possibly prisons end up in hospital for ICU care. |
It'll be interesting to see the effect on the overall number of deaths. The figure for March/April each year (the figures are available via the ONS website) are around 45,000 to 47,000. Only figures for Jan & Feb are available so far for 2020 (and follow the pattern of preceding years: 55,000 or so in Jan, 43,500 or so in Feb).
How far above that sort of number will this years figures be? And will there be an offsetting reduction in (for example) RTA deaths?
The danger with publishing these numbers is that if there isn't a significant increase in the total number of deaths, many will wonder what all the fuss is about. Obivously they must be published, but the scientific and statistical people will have to spell out in words of one syllable (with pictures) what it really means for the likes of the mail, express and sun.
It's likely that the number of deaths from pneumonia will drop as Covid has got there first, but I think it highly likely a significant proportion of those who die weren't long for this world, covid or no covid.
And before anybody gets agitated, I'm not trying to play down the impact on those who get the virus, or on the families of those who die. I'm just concerned that there's an elephant trap that many could stampede into. |  |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 22:52 - Apr 9 with 2150 views | monytowbray |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 22:50 - Apr 9 by factual_blue |
It'll be interesting to see the effect on the overall number of deaths. The figure for March/April each year (the figures are available via the ONS website) are around 45,000 to 47,000. Only figures for Jan & Feb are available so far for 2020 (and follow the pattern of preceding years: 55,000 or so in Jan, 43,500 or so in Feb).
How far above that sort of number will this years figures be? And will there be an offsetting reduction in (for example) RTA deaths?
The danger with publishing these numbers is that if there isn't a significant increase in the total number of deaths, many will wonder what all the fuss is about. Obivously they must be published, but the scientific and statistical people will have to spell out in words of one syllable (with pictures) what it really means for the likes of the mail, express and sun.
It's likely that the number of deaths from pneumonia will drop as Covid has got there first, but I think it highly likely a significant proportion of those who die weren't long for this world, covid or no covid.
And before anybody gets agitated, I'm not trying to play down the impact on those who get the virus, or on the families of those who die. I'm just concerned that there's an elephant trap that many could stampede into. |
Not really thought about that angle. | |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 23:24 - Apr 9 with 2125 views | StokieBlue |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 22:45 - Apr 9 by monytowbray |
Are you actually deflecting fair criticism of hindsight many were calling out at the time as “well what can they do now?” Because I’m not sure what point you are making.
We had weeks to prepare. I went into isolation personally 4 weeks ago today and I was wondering then how the NHS is going to cope with limited resources. Yet here we are. With nurses and carers at risk from a lack of protection, and an admitted risk of a shortage of ventilators. I watched us miss that EU deadline as it was over the news for a week we hadn’t responded. It was madness then, let alone in hindsight.
Not sure what more turns or lies this needs to take before you open your eyes and stop sitting on the fence about this sh1t show and arguing pedantics. [Post edited 9 Apr 2020 22:47]
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The point is you started the thread criticising actions on PPE supply, that was an incorrect point so you moved onto something else so you could continue your criticism and never returned to the point at hand even when asked to respond.
It's not pedantic. You say one thing, get it wrong and then change it to something else so you can continue your broadsides. It's entirely motivated by wanting to criticise rather than wanting to be accurate.
I've agreed the ventilators are an issue. that's not what we were talking about. You continually shift the goalposts in order to maintain your attacks.
SB |  | | |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 23:28 - Apr 9 with 2119 views | monytowbray |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 23:24 - Apr 9 by StokieBlue |
The point is you started the thread criticising actions on PPE supply, that was an incorrect point so you moved onto something else so you could continue your criticism and never returned to the point at hand even when asked to respond.
It's not pedantic. You say one thing, get it wrong and then change it to something else so you can continue your broadsides. It's entirely motivated by wanting to criticise rather than wanting to be accurate.
I've agreed the ventilators are an issue. that's not what we were talking about. You continually shift the goalposts in order to maintain your attacks.
SB |
What’s changed in my stance about the PPE supply? Where was my statement incorrect?
I went back to the PPE part 3 posts ago. And explained how the EU ventilator scheme tied in which drove off into that point as well.
I’m struggling to find the part in what I have said here that was incorrect. Even Glasser’s response was comically laughable and it got an uppie from you. Imagine the meltdown you’d have if I said that.
I’ve told you before. I see through your act more than others. Because this narrative you’ve created of changing subject isn’t there.
EDIT: Went back and read it, I didn’t even bring ventilators up first. I responded to other posters on that subject when they brought it up. I’ve said before who your behaviour reminds me of when you do this and you know the exact word I use to describe it, but I’m not having that one out with you again. Just stop inventing rubbish. No one’s even piling in which says something. [Post edited 9 Apr 2020 23:33]
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 23:39 - Apr 9 with 2110 views | StokieBlue |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 23:28 - Apr 9 by monytowbray |
What’s changed in my stance about the PPE supply? Where was my statement incorrect?
I went back to the PPE part 3 posts ago. And explained how the EU ventilator scheme tied in which drove off into that point as well.
I’m struggling to find the part in what I have said here that was incorrect. Even Glasser’s response was comically laughable and it got an uppie from you. Imagine the meltdown you’d have if I said that.
I’ve told you before. I see through your act more than others. Because this narrative you’ve created of changing subject isn’t there.
EDIT: Went back and read it, I didn’t even bring ventilators up first. I responded to other posters on that subject when they brought it up. I’ve said before who your behaviour reminds me of when you do this and you know the exact word I use to describe it, but I’m not having that one out with you again. Just stop inventing rubbish. No one’s even piling in which says something. [Post edited 9 Apr 2020 23:33]
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You were wrong in that post.
France are part of the EU ventilator scheme and have a huge shortage of PPE. The shipment the US took from China was to them and then they took another one destined for Germany who are also short as are other EU countries. The scheme is not some kind of unlimited golden bullet which solves all the problems like you continually make it out to be.
There is a global shortage, nothing you posted countered that and explained how the UK were supposed to be able to source the equipment better than they are doing. If the equipment doesn't exist you can't get it. We should have more as I said but nobody had the levels required for a pandemic. You seem to think we should have been different to every other country in the world.
Act? I find that quite offensive. You say it a lot yet nobody ever agrees with you. You can't ever accept that you might possibly be wrong and thus it must be the other person.
SB
Edit:
You posted that the ventilator scheme included equipment in your edit so you literally tied it to the equipment argument.
You mean the word you used on me and then about 10 respected posters told you that it was incorrect and you were wrong? Yes I remember perfectly and you were wrong then as you are now.
Disgraceful.
[Post edited 9 Apr 2020 23:41]
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 00:00 - Apr 10 with 2099 views | monytowbray |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 23:39 - Apr 9 by StokieBlue |
You were wrong in that post.
France are part of the EU ventilator scheme and have a huge shortage of PPE. The shipment the US took from China was to them and then they took another one destined for Germany who are also short as are other EU countries. The scheme is not some kind of unlimited golden bullet which solves all the problems like you continually make it out to be.
There is a global shortage, nothing you posted countered that and explained how the UK were supposed to be able to source the equipment better than they are doing. If the equipment doesn't exist you can't get it. We should have more as I said but nobody had the levels required for a pandemic. You seem to think we should have been different to every other country in the world.
Act? I find that quite offensive. You say it a lot yet nobody ever agrees with you. You can't ever accept that you might possibly be wrong and thus it must be the other person.
SB
Edit:
You posted that the ventilator scheme included equipment in your edit so you literally tied it to the equipment argument.
You mean the word you used on me and then about 10 respected posters told you that it was incorrect and you were wrong? Yes I remember perfectly and you were wrong then as you are now.
Disgraceful.
[Post edited 9 Apr 2020 23:41]
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But you’re debating the nows and not the point that got us here. We had time to prepare, we didn’t. I’m not the only person who said that.
Look, go back and read the thread. I didn’t bring up ventilators to change the subject. 3 other posters started talking about that. I replied to them.
What do you achieve by changing the narrative and lying? The response to Glassers was about him point scoring and backfired. It was actually him who used the ventilator scheme in the EU as a swerve, not me. It’s there for all to read.
This post has been edited by an administrator | |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 00:09 - Apr 10 with 2091 views | StokieBlue |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 00:00 - Apr 10 by monytowbray |
But you’re debating the nows and not the point that got us here. We had time to prepare, we didn’t. I’m not the only person who said that.
Look, go back and read the thread. I didn’t bring up ventilators to change the subject. 3 other posters started talking about that. I replied to them.
What do you achieve by changing the narrative and lying? The response to Glassers was about him point scoring and backfired. It was actually him who used the ventilator scheme in the EU as a swerve, not me. It’s there for all to read.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
You posted a thread with an OP criticising the government about the lack of PPE. I responded showing it wasn't just this country and that it was actually impossible to be prepared for a pandemic in the way you were wanting and thus your criticism wasn't entirely fair.
Tractor mentioned ventilators and nothing to do with PPE and then in a response directly to me you tied in the ventilator scheme to PPE. I then responded saying it wasn't a magic bullet you were claiming for everything that is wrong with the government response. You changed the narrative by implying PPE could have been got through that scheme which is nothing like your original argument and it's also incorrect given Germany and France can't get enough.
Abusive when challenged and rather unpleasant.
SB
This post has been edited by an administrator | | | |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 01:15 - Apr 10 with 2037 views | Tangledupin_Blue |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 19:55 - Apr 9 by GlasgowBlue |
Bloody Tories!!!!!! Really screwed up over this in Italy, France and Spain. Boris Out!!!! Blah blah blah!!!!! |
Classic whataboutery. |  |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 06:33 - Apr 10 with 1991 views | m14_blue |
Without wanting to get involved, I think you’ve got SB totally wrong. | | | |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 08:12 - Apr 10 with 1944 views | giant_stow |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 22:50 - Apr 9 by factual_blue |
It'll be interesting to see the effect on the overall number of deaths. The figure for March/April each year (the figures are available via the ONS website) are around 45,000 to 47,000. Only figures for Jan & Feb are available so far for 2020 (and follow the pattern of preceding years: 55,000 or so in Jan, 43,500 or so in Feb).
How far above that sort of number will this years figures be? And will there be an offsetting reduction in (for example) RTA deaths?
The danger with publishing these numbers is that if there isn't a significant increase in the total number of deaths, many will wonder what all the fuss is about. Obivously they must be published, but the scientific and statistical people will have to spell out in words of one syllable (with pictures) what it really means for the likes of the mail, express and sun.
It's likely that the number of deaths from pneumonia will drop as Covid has got there first, but I think it highly likely a significant proportion of those who die weren't long for this world, covid or no covid.
And before anybody gets agitated, I'm not trying to play down the impact on those who get the virus, or on the families of those who die. I'm just concerned that there's an elephant trap that many could stampede into. |
Was watching a show* last night which was warning that people are put off going to hospital for non-covid issues at the moment. Apparently in the sars epidemic, mortality rates similarly went up for heart attacks, strokes etc for the same reason. So could be the all-death rate actually rises.
*maybe newsnight, but i was well addled.
Edit: it was Newsnight and the main jist was a warning to people to not be put off going to hospital - particularly parents with ill kids. There were some heartbreaking stories about kids with illnesses which have died (one was meningitis which has similar symptoms apparently) cos their folks were too scared to go to hospital. [Post edited 10 Apr 2020 8:35]
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 08:33 - Apr 10 with 1920 views | No9 |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 19:12 - Apr 9 by StokieBlue |
It's not as easy as you make out though.
Every single country in the world is trying to get more PPE gear to the point where the US are active outbidding other developed countries on the runway as the plane is about to leave.
I agree we need more PPE gear but the implication seems to be we aren't trying to get it?
SB |
"I agree we need more PPE gear but the implication seems to be we aren't trying to get it? "
There may be substance to that at least as far the the most important stuff is concerned
It is certainly being rationed to some in the medical profession.
Errors seem to have been made as late as edn Feb - Mid March
Now it is re-emerging, or new strain in Asia things are not going to get better | | | |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 08:53 - Apr 10 with 1906 views | NewcyBlue |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 08:33 - Apr 10 by No9 |
"I agree we need more PPE gear but the implication seems to be we aren't trying to get it? "
There may be substance to that at least as far the the most important stuff is concerned
It is certainly being rationed to some in the medical profession.
Errors seem to have been made as late as edn Feb - Mid March
Now it is re-emerging, or new strain in Asia things are not going to get better |
MrsN’s hospital have sent out an email downgrading the PPE requirements. They just haven’t got the right PPE, so have changed the required PPE.
It’s atrocious. Yet, you can’t really stockpile stuff like masks. They have an expiry date. Hard hats have an expiry date too as an example of random PPE requirements.
If you accept expired PPE, you’re not covered. It’s as simple as that.
I’ve bought MrsN PPE for when she returns back to work. I’m not having her working without it. |  |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 09:28 - Apr 10 with 1868 views | xrayspecs |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 22:50 - Apr 9 by factual_blue |
It'll be interesting to see the effect on the overall number of deaths. The figure for March/April each year (the figures are available via the ONS website) are around 45,000 to 47,000. Only figures for Jan & Feb are available so far for 2020 (and follow the pattern of preceding years: 55,000 or so in Jan, 43,500 or so in Feb).
How far above that sort of number will this years figures be? And will there be an offsetting reduction in (for example) RTA deaths?
The danger with publishing these numbers is that if there isn't a significant increase in the total number of deaths, many will wonder what all the fuss is about. Obivously they must be published, but the scientific and statistical people will have to spell out in words of one syllable (with pictures) what it really means for the likes of the mail, express and sun.
It's likely that the number of deaths from pneumonia will drop as Covid has got there first, but I think it highly likely a significant proportion of those who die weren't long for this world, covid or no covid.
And before anybody gets agitated, I'm not trying to play down the impact on those who get the virus, or on the families of those who die. I'm just concerned that there's an elephant trap that many could stampede into. |
I agree, These will give us a sense of how many additional deaths there are this year compared to a normal year, the big picture view that we do not get from the daily stats.
There are going to be knock on effects to our response to Covid19:
- Around 7k (I believe) folk die of seasonal flu each year, I would imagine that there will be some overlap here and some of those who would have died of seasonal flu have succumbed to Covid-19 instead.
- We should see reductions in road travel accidents and other travel related deaths , industrial accidents and general violence etc. Social distancing is not good for terrorism either.
- We may see increases where patient treatment is delayed or cancelled. While the NHS is trying to maintain cancer care, we know that the transplantation programme has ground to a halt. Hospitals are no longer safe places for vulnerable folk so even if care continues, there is increased risk of being infected with all the consequences.
- Non-essential care for chronic conditions e.g. asthma/COPD clinics are being cancelled/delayed, the impact of which may not become clear for some time
- We do not know how the current situation will impact the number of mental health or domestic violence episodes, it is reasonable to assume that these will go up.
There are probably other elements that I have missed, but the general point is that this is not just about Covid19, it is also about how our response to it affects the broader health of the population.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52239183
Keep well. | | | |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 11:46 - Apr 10 with 1800 views | monytowbray |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 08:53 - Apr 10 by NewcyBlue |
MrsN’s hospital have sent out an email downgrading the PPE requirements. They just haven’t got the right PPE, so have changed the required PPE.
It’s atrocious. Yet, you can’t really stockpile stuff like masks. They have an expiry date. Hard hats have an expiry date too as an example of random PPE requirements.
If you accept expired PPE, you’re not covered. It’s as simple as that.
I’ve bought MrsN PPE for when she returns back to work. I’m not having her working without it. |
It’s not just stockpiling though. It’s also combined with an underfunded health care system and nothing done when those in power were warned to do something in early February at the earliest.
There is a real “cause and effect” factor in the whole thing that is now being ignored as if it wasn’t preventable. | |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 12:00 - Apr 10 with 1772 views | NewcyBlue |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 11:46 - Apr 10 by monytowbray |
It’s not just stockpiling though. It’s also combined with an underfunded health care system and nothing done when those in power were warned to do something in early February at the earliest.
There is a real “cause and effect” factor in the whole thing that is now being ignored as if it wasn’t preventable. |
The NHS has been underfunded for a long long time. I don’t think we will ever be happy with funding, and nor should we. The NHS should get whatever it needs.
As for early warning signs
You have to ask what would have happened had China reported honestly. The root cause of this all, a wet food market.
How many lives have the Chinese cost by not reporting accurately.
I got off the ship on 31st Jan in Singapore. The following day they stopped crew from flying home from Singapore if they had been to China in the last 14 days. By then it was too late, millions of people had flown all over the world taking Coronavirus with them. | |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 12:09 - Apr 10 with 1757 views | monytowbray |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 12:00 - Apr 10 by NewcyBlue |
The NHS has been underfunded for a long long time. I don’t think we will ever be happy with funding, and nor should we. The NHS should get whatever it needs.
As for early warning signs
You have to ask what would have happened had China reported honestly. The root cause of this all, a wet food market.
How many lives have the Chinese cost by not reporting accurately.
I got off the ship on 31st Jan in Singapore. The following day they stopped crew from flying home from Singapore if they had been to China in the last 14 days. By then it was too late, millions of people had flown all over the world taking Coronavirus with them. |
Oh the CCP f*cked it for sure. And serious questions of their global relations needs to be asked when things go back to normal.
But all the seeds of where this was going were clear by early February. We were going with herd immunity til mid-March. You’d think if that was a thought out plan we’d be prepared for that plan on the healthcare front if it wasn’t completely winged in the hope it would just go away. | |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 12:23 - Apr 10 with 1748 views | pointofblue |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 12:09 - Apr 10 by monytowbray |
Oh the CCP f*cked it for sure. And serious questions of their global relations needs to be asked when things go back to normal.
But all the seeds of where this was going were clear by early February. We were going with herd immunity til mid-March. You’d think if that was a thought out plan we’d be prepared for that plan on the healthcare front if it wasn’t completely winged in the hope it would just go away. |
Out of interest what do you think should be happening now to sort it out? I completely agree we possibly weren’t as direct and pro-active as we should have been and there will be queries and enquiries relating to the responses to the pandemic once a semblance of normality has returned and quite rightly so.
But what should happen now as this is the situation we’re in and looking back and moaning isn’t going to help those on the ground, their friends and relatives or those suffering from the disease at this moment in time? | |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 12:32 - Apr 10 with 1740 views | monytowbray |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 12:23 - Apr 10 by pointofblue |
Out of interest what do you think should be happening now to sort it out? I completely agree we possibly weren’t as direct and pro-active as we should have been and there will be queries and enquiries relating to the responses to the pandemic once a semblance of normality has returned and quite rightly so.
But what should happen now as this is the situation we’re in and looking back and moaning isn’t going to help those on the ground, their friends and relatives or those suffering from the disease at this moment in time? |
What we do now I don’t have the answer for, but I was vocal about all of this coming home to roost weeks ago when we could have acted and was told to shut up by many on here who have since gone a bit quiet.
What we do now is frantically run around hoping for the best outcome because we truly f*cked it. Italy and Spain were the warning sign we ignored. Herd immunity without actually preparing the NHS. Still amazes me people defended that idea at the time and some still do as if it was an actual strategy and with considerations. Perhaps even the Tories are blind to the impact of their cuts but I doubt it.
Like Grenfell, when all is said and done, the enquiry will conclude it was someone else’s fault and scapegoat them. | |
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| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 12:40 - Apr 10 with 1722 views | Leaky |
My partner works in a care home. She say's she gets through approximately 40 pairs of gloves & 40 aprons a day that's roughly 2o0 a week times that by all the care staff in the Uk. Then you have NHS & police requirements that's one hell of an amount. Times that around the world you then get the scale of things. |  | | |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 12:44 - Apr 10 with 1717 views | portmanking |
| Even their own cheerleaders are turning... on 12:40 - Apr 10 by Leaky |
My partner works in a care home. She say's she gets through approximately 40 pairs of gloves & 40 aprons a day that's roughly 2o0 a week times that by all the care staff in the Uk. Then you have NHS & police requirements that's one hell of an amount. Times that around the world you then get the scale of things. |
But if we kick, scream and stamp our feet rather than come up with sensible solutions, it'll all work out, right? | | | |
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