| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ 13:10 - Apr 22 with 10244 views | MaySixth |
he has run rings round the Tories again
no wonder they wanted the students in opposition
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 22:51 - Apr 22 with 1145 views | gazzer1999 |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 22:30 - Apr 22 by MaySixth |
Tories panicking on here.
Love it. |
Really? |  | | |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 22:59 - Apr 22 with 1134 views | SpruceMoose |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 22:46 - Apr 22 by jeera |
Relevance? |
Oh dear. Yet again poor old Gazzer opens his mouth and a whoopsie falls out!
Silly Gazzer. |  |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 23:23 - Apr 22 with 1114 views | tractordownsouth |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 19:52 - Apr 22 by londontractorboy57 |
Anyone can criticise perhaps somebody should ask starmer what he would do? millionaire champagne socialist |
Hear hear... I hate that out of touch son of a toolmaker and a nurse... I much prefer that old etonian Prime Minister who said that blue collar workers were "drunk, feckless and lazy" |  |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 23:24 - Apr 22 with 1114 views | tractordownsouth |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 20:11 - Apr 22 by Pinewoodblue |
Labour needed to appoint a leader that ticked a minimum of 2 of these 4 boxes if they wanted to win the next election.
1 Not representing a London constituency
2 Female
3 Non white
4 Not someone who represents the establishment.
Sir Keir Starmer didn’t manage to tick any of them.
Just a personal opinion. |
Isn't this exactly the kind of identity politics that a lot of right wingers claim to hate? | |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 07:59 - Apr 23 with 1056 views | Herbivore |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 23:24 - Apr 22 by tractordownsouth |
Isn't this exactly the kind of identity politics that a lot of right wingers claim to hate? |
I do find it amusing when people who would never vote Labour try to offer a view on what they think would make other people vote Labour. It's almost as good as when people who voted for old Etonian Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson criticise Keir Starmer for having earned himself a good living and having earned a knighthood. Clearly it's fine to be born into the establishment and think poor people are scum, but heaven forbid you work your way up from working class roots. |  |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 08:17 - Apr 23 with 1042 views | Darth_Koont |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 07:59 - Apr 23 by Herbivore |
I do find it amusing when people who would never vote Labour try to offer a view on what they think would make other people vote Labour. It's almost as good as when people who voted for old Etonian Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson criticise Keir Starmer for having earned himself a good living and having earned a knighthood. Clearly it's fine to be born into the establishment and think poor people are scum, but heaven forbid you work your way up from working class roots. |
We should never underestimate the Establishment's need to define what is acceptable opposition. Seems that a lot of the centre and right like the fact that Starmer appears "controllable" and not particularly threatening to their vested interests.
I hope he proves them wrong.
On a connected note, this was good to see from Nandy. It's by pushing on this sort of point that Labour will get the sort of reaction that shows they are providing real opposition:
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 08:26 - Apr 23 with 1026 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 08:17 - Apr 23 by Darth_Koont |
We should never underestimate the Establishment's need to define what is acceptable opposition. Seems that a lot of the centre and right like the fact that Starmer appears "controllable" and not particularly threatening to their vested interests.
I hope he proves them wrong.
On a connected note, this was good to see from Nandy. It's by pushing on this sort of point that Labour will get the sort of reaction that shows they are providing real opposition:
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And from the JLM, whom you have attempted to discredit over the years on here as Israel apologists.
It’s as if people can actually criticise the state of Israel without having to fall back in antisemitic tropes isn’t it? |  |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 08:47 - Apr 23 with 1012 views | Darth_Koont |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 08:26 - Apr 23 by GlasgowBlue |
And from the JLM, whom you have attempted to discredit over the years on here as Israel apologists.
It’s as if people can actually criticise the state of Israel without having to fall back in antisemitic tropes isn’t it? |
I never said that the JLM were total monsters. They've even been critical of the settler movement in the recent past. Good for them.
But their record on antisemitism in the Labour Party is very poor. It's been a factional campaign for too many of them. | |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 09:12 - Apr 23 with 989 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 07:59 - Apr 23 by Herbivore |
I do find it amusing when people who would never vote Labour try to offer a view on what they think would make other people vote Labour. It's almost as good as when people who voted for old Etonian Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson criticise Keir Starmer for having earned himself a good living and having earned a knighthood. Clearly it's fine to be born into the establishment and think poor people are scum, but heaven forbid you work your way up from working class roots. |
I have only ever belonged to one political party and that was Labour, joined in 1964, can’t remember when I let it lapse.
I have also been a union rep but that was a longtime ago.
Sad how you allow your prejudices to cloud your judgement on so many things. |  |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 09:12 - Apr 23 with 989 views | brazil1982 |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 22:30 - Apr 22 by MaySixth |
Tories panicking on here.
Love it. |
Really?
I welcome a strong opposition, let's hope Starmer and the Shadow Cabinet turn out to be opposition that holds the government to account. Nothing to "panic" about. |  | | |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 09:13 - Apr 23 with 989 views | manchego |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 20:11 - Apr 22 by Pinewoodblue |
Labour needed to appoint a leader that ticked a minimum of 2 of these 4 boxes if they wanted to win the next election.
1 Not representing a London constituency
2 Female
3 Non white
4 Not someone who represents the establishment.
Sir Keir Starmer didn’t manage to tick any of them.
Just a personal opinion. |
The stupidity of the first sentence makes everything else you said irrelevant. |  | | |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 09:27 - Apr 23 with 976 views | itfcjoe |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 22:33 - Apr 22 by jeera |
Except that's assuming all equipment would be, or is, coming from a limited source.
There is no reason the UK, or any country, cannot look within its own industry.
There are hundreds of thousands of gloves, aprons, masks being made somewhere daily.
I have no idea of the figures regarding how many firms have approached the government or how many, if indeed any, have been approached.
Without specifics it's impossible to know. But firms have allegedly come forward and not been asked what they can offer.
Hypothetically I have a factory in Leicester or Rochdale or Wembley. Send me samples, give me the specifications and I will let you know if I can help.
If cotton can be melt blown to be of use to a layer in a face mask then they'll be just as useful as one made in Turkey.
These people make clothing all day for M&S, Debenhams, New Look...they're not amateurs. Why are other countries suddenly the only potential sources or Burberry, as an example. Not that masks are of great help but all staff need them anyway.
Aprons have to be repellent. Ok, so is it the fabric that is in short supply or the manpower to make them?
Quality control is performed on every line anyway and again, there's no reason why batch checking can only be performed if items come from a source outside of this country. The rules are the same. So is the suggestion we're short of batch checkers?
Speculation is no use if we are starved of information, which we do seem to be.
If materials are in short supply then it would be nice to be told. The lack of detail suggests they are relying on known sources and not using their imagination. So much for the wartime rhetoric and not employing every doorstep opportunity.
I maintain I doubt our officials would know where to look for help outside of names they're familiar with. |
My Mother in Law works in a school uniform factory, they have made a load of scrubs but keep running out of material.
In their locality there is a sewing group making them at a rate of about 2 per day with a load of material - they've contacted them to ask for the material but the sewing group want to keep it as their members are enjoying it....
Her factory only has about 5 people working in it, but can chuck out serious quantities every day.
There was a report today that the NHS used to source this themselves and 3 weeks ago the Govt elected to take it into Whitehall
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/04/22/decision-take-control-ppe-coming-bac
“The fateful decision was taken in the final week of March,” Bill Gardner reports. “Instead of leaving the NHS to solve the problem, ministers decided to take control themselves. Little more than three weeks later, according to Whitehall sources and industry insiders, that move may have backfired.” |  |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 09:30 - Apr 23 with 966 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 08:26 - Apr 23 by GlasgowBlue |
And from the JLM, whom you have attempted to discredit over the years on here as Israel apologists.
It’s as if people can actually criticise the state of Israel without having to fall back in antisemitic tropes isn’t it? |
What is it called when you want to deny Palestinians the right to a state? |  |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 09:35 - Apr 23 with 957 views | longtimefan |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 22:33 - Apr 22 by jeera |
Except that's assuming all equipment would be, or is, coming from a limited source.
There is no reason the UK, or any country, cannot look within its own industry.
There are hundreds of thousands of gloves, aprons, masks being made somewhere daily.
I have no idea of the figures regarding how many firms have approached the government or how many, if indeed any, have been approached.
Without specifics it's impossible to know. But firms have allegedly come forward and not been asked what they can offer.
Hypothetically I have a factory in Leicester or Rochdale or Wembley. Send me samples, give me the specifications and I will let you know if I can help.
If cotton can be melt blown to be of use to a layer in a face mask then they'll be just as useful as one made in Turkey.
These people make clothing all day for M&S, Debenhams, New Look...they're not amateurs. Why are other countries suddenly the only potential sources or Burberry, as an example. Not that masks are of great help but all staff need them anyway.
Aprons have to be repellent. Ok, so is it the fabric that is in short supply or the manpower to make them?
Quality control is performed on every line anyway and again, there's no reason why batch checking can only be performed if items come from a source outside of this country. The rules are the same. So is the suggestion we're short of batch checkers?
Speculation is no use if we are starved of information, which we do seem to be.
If materials are in short supply then it would be nice to be told. The lack of detail suggests they are relying on known sources and not using their imagination. So much for the wartime rhetoric and not employing every doorstep opportunity.
I maintain I doubt our officials would know where to look for help outside of names they're familiar with. |
According to BBC this morning it seems there's something special about the material used for the gowns.
"This is because the UK only has one manufacturer that can make them and because they use quite specialist material other companies have not simply been able to change what they are producing."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52388684 |  | | |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:22 - Apr 23 with 916 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 07:59 - Apr 23 by Herbivore |
I do find it amusing when people who would never vote Labour try to offer a view on what they think would make other people vote Labour. It's almost as good as when people who voted for old Etonian Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson criticise Keir Starmer for having earned himself a good living and having earned a knighthood. Clearly it's fine to be born into the establishment and think poor people are scum, but heaven forbid you work your way up from working class roots. |
Incorrect. Labour need to appeal to people that don’t vote Labour in order to be successful - appealing to just Labour voters has led them nowhere. Therefore the views of people that don’t vote Labour absolutely are relevant
I make Pinewood half right - I think some of the boxes he highlights are irrelevant (a female leader would have been a nice first but I don’t think it would have helped at the ballot box, for example) but I do think Starmer’s London seat and perception of him will prove a challenge to overcome in some areas, particularly the north |  |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:32 - Apr 23 with 900 views | tractordownsouth |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:22 - Apr 23 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Incorrect. Labour need to appeal to people that don’t vote Labour in order to be successful - appealing to just Labour voters has led them nowhere. Therefore the views of people that don’t vote Labour absolutely are relevant
I make Pinewood half right - I think some of the boxes he highlights are irrelevant (a female leader would have been a nice first but I don’t think it would have helped at the ballot box, for example) but I do think Starmer’s London seat and perception of him will prove a challenge to overcome in some areas, particularly the north |
Of course we need to reach out, but Herb's point is definitely valid... most of the people pointing out the "white man from London" thing are people who'd never vote Labour anyway. There's a difference between swing voters and tribal Tories. | |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:38 - Apr 23 with 890 views | Herbivore |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:22 - Apr 23 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Incorrect. Labour need to appeal to people that don’t vote Labour in order to be successful - appealing to just Labour voters has led them nowhere. Therefore the views of people that don’t vote Labour absolutely are relevant
I make Pinewood half right - I think some of the boxes he highlights are irrelevant (a female leader would have been a nice first but I don’t think it would have helped at the ballot box, for example) but I do think Starmer’s London seat and perception of him will prove a challenge to overcome in some areas, particularly the north |
Incorrect. It would help you greatly if you actually read my post carefully before replying.
Labour need to appeal to people that would consider voting Labour and that may have done in the past. There's not much point in them trying to appeal to the right wingers on here who like to opine over what a Labour leader should or shouldn't be when they have no intention of ever voting Labour. Labour need to appeal to those in the centre and they need to reengage their traditional base whilst maintaining their current support. No easy task, but not one that would be more achievable if the leader ticked some boxes made up by a Tory who would vote for a dog turd with a blue rosette on it rather than vote Labour. | |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:39 - Apr 23 with 888 views | Herbivore |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:32 - Apr 23 by tractordownsouth |
Of course we need to reach out, but Herb's point is definitely valid... most of the people pointing out the "white man from London" thing are people who'd never vote Labour anyway. There's a difference between swing voters and tribal Tories. |
The people pointing this out voted for a white man from London. The people pointing this out are mocking Starmer for being establishment whilst voting for one of the most establishment PMs we've ever had. It's a load of BS. | |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:41 - Apr 23 with 884 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:22 - Apr 23 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Incorrect. Labour need to appeal to people that don’t vote Labour in order to be successful - appealing to just Labour voters has led them nowhere. Therefore the views of people that don’t vote Labour absolutely are relevant
I make Pinewood half right - I think some of the boxes he highlights are irrelevant (a female leader would have been a nice first but I don’t think it would have helped at the ballot box, for example) but I do think Starmer’s London seat and perception of him will prove a challenge to overcome in some areas, particularly the north |
Suppose being only half wrong is an improvement!
Sadly I was right about the last election when I predicted many seats in the north of England would elect Tory MPs for the first time. Those seats need to be won back.
Herbieboy couldn’t see that happening. | |
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| Agree.. with a caveat on 10:50 - Apr 23 with 870 views | unstableblue |
He was calm, professional, fact based... and most importantly very credible.
He really did expose the weakness of Corbyn.
Tories are going to be concerned by Starmer (he's a lawyer)... as the scrutiny of the Brexit process will I am sure be equally professional, and that really is a basket case
I do think he was wrong to criticise 'slow to lock-down' as it was scientific advice. Right to criticise testing and PPE, woefully slow. |  |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 11:25 - Apr 23 with 854 views | Herbivore |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:41 - Apr 23 by Pinewoodblue |
Suppose being only half wrong is an improvement!
Sadly I was right about the last election when I predicted many seats in the north of England would elect Tory MPs for the first time. Those seats need to be won back.
Herbieboy couldn’t see that happening. |
I didn't predict anything other than a Tory majority at the last election. You've never been much cop at getting your facts right though. | |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 11:32 - Apr 23 with 848 views | Mullet |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:22 - Apr 23 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Incorrect. Labour need to appeal to people that don’t vote Labour in order to be successful - appealing to just Labour voters has led them nowhere. Therefore the views of people that don’t vote Labour absolutely are relevant
I make Pinewood half right - I think some of the boxes he highlights are irrelevant (a female leader would have been a nice first but I don’t think it would have helped at the ballot box, for example) but I do think Starmer’s London seat and perception of him will prove a challenge to overcome in some areas, particularly the north |
It doesn't help that every other tweet and Facebook post I see from a Labour member is doing the hard work for the Tories.
This idea that "centrist" appeal is bad or that Blair giving them their best run in power in decades is not to be repeated, absolutely baffles me. It's like wanting Ipswich to back some tinpot regionalised league set up so it can be new and authentic and ensures we never win a European Cup again. |  |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 11:36 - Apr 23 with 839 views | giant_stow |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 11:32 - Apr 23 by Mullet |
It doesn't help that every other tweet and Facebook post I see from a Labour member is doing the hard work for the Tories.
This idea that "centrist" appeal is bad or that Blair giving them their best run in power in decades is not to be repeated, absolutely baffles me. It's like wanting Ipswich to back some tinpot regionalised league set up so it can be new and authentic and ensures we never win a European Cup again. |
so true.
(grr, fcking centrist blue labour scum) |  |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 11:44 - Apr 23 with 823 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 11:32 - Apr 23 by Mullet |
It doesn't help that every other tweet and Facebook post I see from a Labour member is doing the hard work for the Tories.
This idea that "centrist" appeal is bad or that Blair giving them their best run in power in decades is not to be repeated, absolutely baffles me. It's like wanting Ipswich to back some tinpot regionalised league set up so it can be new and authentic and ensures we never win a European Cup again. |
Labour is a broad church, but we only hear from the mouthy. | |
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| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 11:46 - Apr 23 with 820 views | m14_blue |
| Keir Starmer absolutely nailed his first PMQ on 10:22 - Apr 23 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Incorrect. Labour need to appeal to people that don’t vote Labour in order to be successful - appealing to just Labour voters has led them nowhere. Therefore the views of people that don’t vote Labour absolutely are relevant
I make Pinewood half right - I think some of the boxes he highlights are irrelevant (a female leader would have been a nice first but I don’t think it would have helped at the ballot box, for example) but I do think Starmer’s London seat and perception of him will prove a challenge to overcome in some areas, particularly the north |
I don’t think you read what he said properly.
I make Pinewood completely wrong. Anyone who thinks the working class Labour areas that turned Tory last time are desperate for a black woman to represent them is way off the mark.
I don’t mean that as an insult but I’ve spent almost my whole life in the ‘Red wall’ and this just isn’t remotely what the problem was with Corbyn. The fact they all voted for Boris shows that rich, white and London centric aren’t necessarily a block. [Post edited 23 Apr 2020 11:46]
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