| Will our captain 19:59 - Nov 29 with 17273 views | chicoazul |
be wearing rainbow laces or the armband this weekend? |  |
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| Will our captain on 08:07 - Nov 30 with 2451 views | SitfcB |
| Will our captain on 07:43 - Nov 30 by Kievthegreat |
I feel this was said flippantly (but I may be mis-judging so apologies if so). However I think it is the correct choice. The Captain represents not just himself, but the team with that band and position. If he can't wear the rainbow armband for those 2 games for his personal reason, he shouldn't wear the armband for those 2 games and someone else should instead. [Post edited 30 Nov 2024 7:43]
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No I said it seriously, just have a different captain for the two games and save Morsy all the (potential) hassle because no doubt social media and the press will pick it up. |  |
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| Will our captain on 08:07 - Nov 30 with 2451 views | Reus30 |
| Will our captain on 07:32 - Nov 30 by Swansea_Blue |
“where was the armband for mens international day two weeks ago?”
The club did more than wear arm bands, they hosted Mind for an event https://ukmensday.org.uk/event/suffolk-mind24/.
On top of that, the club has done loads with Mind over the years. Most clubs do. Mind are official partners of the Prem and EFL and there are always logos on show and on kits, T-shirts worn by players, events, interviews, etc.
Every cause deserves its place in the limelight imo. It shouldn’t be competitive. |
Fair enough, didn't see it. Certainly didn't seem as pushed if it was a premier League wide thing and obviously the club do an exceptional job on that front so that doesn't suprise.
100 percent, if only that was the case though hey. |  | | |
| Will our captain on 08:19 - Nov 30 with 2429 views | itfcjoe |
| Will our captain on 08:07 - Nov 30 by SitfcB |
No I said it seriously, just have a different captain for the two games and save Morsy all the (potential) hassle because no doubt social media and the press will pick it up. |
Thats hardly going to make it go away - why is the guy who has captained every game he’s played since he arrived not done it for 2 games…..! |  |
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| Will our captain on 08:30 - Nov 30 with 2388 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Will our captain on 08:07 - Nov 30 by SitfcB |
No I said it seriously, just have a different captain for the two games and save Morsy all the (potential) hassle because no doubt social media and the press will pick it up. |
"Town captain removed in laces showdown."
Yeah nobody would notice! |  |
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| Will our captain on 08:52 - Nov 30 with 2341 views | Kievthegreat |
| Will our captain on 08:30 - Nov 30 by BanksterDebtSlave |
"Town captain removed in laces showdown."
Yeah nobody would notice! |
I don't think people are too worried about the laces. The issue I think is the armband. I'll be disappointed in anyone that doesn't wear the rainbow laces, but it's all personal choice. I also think that there will be enough players across the league such that any particular player won't cop much flak.
The Armband carries far more significance and is far more noticeable. Sam is sorting of stuck because if he wears the rainbow, it's probably a story (with blowback mainly for Sam). If he refuses and wears a plain one, it's definitely a story (blowback for everyone). If he refuses or passes it on to a teammate, it's also a story (blowback for everyone, but less if it's voluntary).
From a club perspective, I think the first is infinitely preferable, but I don't think Sam feels that he can do that. After that it still feels like passing the armband is better. Even better is if it is Sam's decision to spare the controversy. |  | | |
| Will our captain on 09:11 - Nov 30 with 2306 views | Zx1988 |
Perhaps I'm reading too much into it (has Sam appeared on previous match graphics?), but perhaps the graphic the club has produced for today suggests that Chappers could get the armband?
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| Will our captain on 09:36 - Nov 30 with 2269 views | rkc123 |
| Will our captain on 21:49 - Nov 29 by SitfcB |
Just have a different captain for the next two games.
Anyway, we don’t know if he will/won’t wear it yet so let’s wait and see.
(Yes it’s the armband as well, many players won’t bother with the laces. Also ball plinth and handshake/anthem boards all rainbowed up) [Post edited 29 Nov 2024 21:51]
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I agree, I don't think he should be forced to wear it, but I do think if the league is doing the rainbow armband then a player who is happy to promote that message should wear the armband.
Edit - Just read a couple more posts further along on the thread, I am under no illusion that the move to change captain would go unnoticed, it isn't the point though, if Morsy won't wear it then in my opinion the club needs to say that for those games if he doesn't feel he can promote this message of inclusion that I think most here would agree is a positive message, then he is not the player we want to lead the team out for these games. [Post edited 30 Nov 2024 9:42]
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| Will our captain on 09:39 - Nov 30 with 2249 views | Kievthegreat |
| Will our captain on 09:11 - Nov 30 by Zx1988 |
Perhaps I'm reading too much into it (has Sam appeared on previous match graphics?), but perhaps the graphic the club has produced for today suggests that Chappers could get the armband?
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I don't think there's a a set graphic, but admittedly can't be bothered to go back through tw@tter.
From memory various players and McKenna have appeared on tweets like this. Only thing about this one is that as it's got the rainbow theme on it, they probably thought to play it safe and not have Morsy and not stir.
I doubt they're telling us anything about who is captain via a tweet. | | | |
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| Will our captain on 09:57 - Nov 30 with 2208 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Will our captain on 09:36 - Nov 30 by rkc123 |
I agree, I don't think he should be forced to wear it, but I do think if the league is doing the rainbow armband then a player who is happy to promote that message should wear the armband.
Edit - Just read a couple more posts further along on the thread, I am under no illusion that the move to change captain would go unnoticed, it isn't the point though, if Morsy won't wear it then in my opinion the club needs to say that for those games if he doesn't feel he can promote this message of inclusion that I think most here would agree is a positive message, then he is not the player we want to lead the team out for these games. [Post edited 30 Nov 2024 9:42]
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Arm band or not Sam is our leader.
Only potential problem, if he isn’t wearing the arm band, he approaches the ref and gets booked missing Tuesday evenings game. |  |
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| Will our captain on 10:10 - Nov 30 with 2177 views | Kievthegreat |
| Will our captain on 09:57 - Nov 30 by Pinewoodblue |
Arm band or not Sam is our leader.
Only potential problem, if he isn’t wearing the arm band, he approaches the ref and gets booked missing Tuesday evenings game. |
Booking would help avoid any further controversy though! | | | |
| Will our captain on 10:13 - Nov 30 with 2160 views | GlasgowBlue |
I said this on the other thread. There wouldn’t be any debate or understanding of his beliefs if Sam was an Evangelical Christian or Roman Catholic. It’s the 21st century FFS. We should be showing support for our LGBTQIA+ supporters. No iffs and no buts. |  |
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| Will our captain on 10:27 - Nov 30 with 2116 views | lowhouseblue |
| Will our captain on 10:13 - Nov 30 by GlasgowBlue |
I said this on the other thread. There wouldn’t be any debate or understanding of his beliefs if Sam was an Evangelical Christian or Roman Catholic. It’s the 21st century FFS. We should be showing support for our LGBTQIA+ supporters. No iffs and no buts. |
we should expect everyone employed by the club, particularly the captain, to show respect and decency to everyone they interact with, regardless of anyone's characteristics of any sort and regardless of their own religion. in the uk discrimination or bigotry towards others is unacceptable whatever your religion. but compelling people to make political statements in a form demanded by others is really very different to that. it's not reasonable to force anyone to enact public gestures just because there is public pressure from some people for them to do that. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Will our captain on 10:28 - Nov 30 with 2112 views | rkc123 |
| Will our captain on 10:13 - Nov 30 by GlasgowBlue |
I said this on the other thread. There wouldn’t be any debate or understanding of his beliefs if Sam was an Evangelical Christian or Roman Catholic. It’s the 21st century FFS. We should be showing support for our LGBTQIA+ supporters. No iffs and no buts. |
When you think about what the rainbow laces actually represent, that people from the LGBTQ + community are welcome in football, it is quite disappointing anyone would decide they cannot support that. [Post edited 30 Nov 2024 10:32]
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| Will our captain on 10:59 - Nov 30 with 2032 views | lowhouseblue |
| Will our captain on 10:28 - Nov 30 by rkc123 |
When you think about what the rainbow laces actually represent, that people from the LGBTQ + community are welcome in football, it is quite disappointing anyone would decide they cannot support that. [Post edited 30 Nov 2024 10:32]
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who gets to decide that wearing a particular item, or enacting a particular gesture, or repeating a specified form of words, has a specific meaning and that only by doing as those people demand can you be taken to be a good person? don't you think it weird that we go along with groups seeking to compel others to act in a way that they have specified in order to demonstrate their agreement with some cause - and that if they don't go along with the demands of that group they're then a bad person? for example, i thought we'd all agreed that not wearing a poppy didn't mean that you were indifferent to, or contemptuous about, the sacrifice of people in past wars? but with stuff like this we're going back to the equivalent of the 1950s when people got challenged on the street for not wearing a poppy. compelling others to make gestures, and condemning them if they don't, is really oppressive. [Post edited 30 Nov 2024 11:00]
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| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Will our captain on 11:37 - Nov 30 with 1963 views | PrideOfTheEast |
| Will our captain on 08:19 - Nov 30 by itfcjoe |
Thats hardly going to make it go away - why is the guy who has captained every game he’s played since he arrived not done it for 2 games…..! |
Exactly and doesn’t solve the issue if that’s his stance. Let’s be honest it gets to the heart of the overall issue that some people appear to have with societal integration or lack of it.
Hope he wears it. He’s the captain of our club, representing Ipswich town and all that it (not he) stands for, which includes acceptance and inclusivity doesn’t it. | | | |
| Will our captain on 11:42 - Nov 30 with 1939 views | rkc123 |
| Will our captain on 10:59 - Nov 30 by lowhouseblue |
who gets to decide that wearing a particular item, or enacting a particular gesture, or repeating a specified form of words, has a specific meaning and that only by doing as those people demand can you be taken to be a good person? don't you think it weird that we go along with groups seeking to compel others to act in a way that they have specified in order to demonstrate their agreement with some cause - and that if they don't go along with the demands of that group they're then a bad person? for example, i thought we'd all agreed that not wearing a poppy didn't mean that you were indifferent to, or contemptuous about, the sacrifice of people in past wars? but with stuff like this we're going back to the equivalent of the 1950s when people got challenged on the street for not wearing a poppy. compelling others to make gestures, and condemning them if they don't, is really oppressive. [Post edited 30 Nov 2024 11:00]
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Well Stonewall UK decided in the case of the rainbow laces, and then took the idea to other organisations/leagues who agreed it was a cause they wanted to get onboard with. The action this group are compelling is for players to swap their shoe laces, not a huge ask, and the cause is a show of support to a group of people, and a message that they will not be discriminated against if they want to get involved with football as a player or fan. Given footballs history of homophobia amongst players and supporters this is probably quite an important message to share. | | | |
| Will our captain on 11:48 - Nov 30 with 1914 views | J2BLUE |
| Will our captain on 10:13 - Nov 30 by GlasgowBlue |
I said this on the other thread. There wouldn’t be any debate or understanding of his beliefs if Sam was an Evangelical Christian or Roman Catholic. It’s the 21st century FFS. We should be showing support for our LGBTQIA+ supporters. No iffs and no buts. |
I don't think that is correct.
If everyone is forced to wear the laces/armbands then the gesture is meaningless anyway |  |
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| Will our captain on 11:50 - Nov 30 with 1902 views | lowhouseblue |
| Will our captain on 11:37 - Nov 30 by PrideOfTheEast |
Exactly and doesn’t solve the issue if that’s his stance. Let’s be honest it gets to the heart of the overall issue that some people appear to have with societal integration or lack of it.
Hope he wears it. He’s the captain of our club, representing Ipswich town and all that it (not he) stands for, which includes acceptance and inclusivity doesn’t it. |
"Let’s be honest it gets to the heart of the overall issue that some people appear to have with societal integration or lack of it."
who gets to determine that not wearing particular laces (seriously?), or not making any other random gesture, means that "some people appear to have an overall issue with societal integration or lack of it"? in this case, what if someone disagrees with stonewall (which is behind the campaign] since a huge number of companies and institutions have now withdrawn their support from stonewall. does wearing a stonewall lace mean you support stonewall and agree with everything stonewall says? who gets to decide what exactly the gesture means?
as a hypothetical, what if an activist jewish group declares that at every match played on 7th October each year players and supporters immediately before kick off should kneel and bow their heads to express their opposition to anti-semitism? can we conclude that anyone who doesn't go along with that demand doesn't oppose anti-semitism? who gets to say? [Post edited 30 Nov 2024 11:51]
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| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Will our captain on 11:55 - Nov 30 with 1880 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Will our captain on 11:48 - Nov 30 by J2BLUE |
I don't think that is correct.
If everyone is forced to wear the laces/armbands then the gesture is meaningless anyway |
I'm not saying people should be forced to wear the laces or armband. I'm saying that people should not hold homophobic views based on a book of fairytales. | |
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| Will our captain on 12:00 - Nov 30 with 1852 views | lowhouseblue |
| Will our captain on 11:42 - Nov 30 by rkc123 |
Well Stonewall UK decided in the case of the rainbow laces, and then took the idea to other organisations/leagues who agreed it was a cause they wanted to get onboard with. The action this group are compelling is for players to swap their shoe laces, not a huge ask, and the cause is a show of support to a group of people, and a message that they will not be discriminated against if they want to get involved with football as a player or fan. Given footballs history of homophobia amongst players and supporters this is probably quite an important message to share. |
personally i think stonewall has sadly gone badly astray more generally and i wouldn't want to do anything that might be taken as support for all of stonewall's activities. i'm in the same place as all of the companies and institutions who have backed away from stonewall. that doesn't mean in any way that i don't oppose discrimination and bigotry. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Will our captain on 12:14 - Nov 30 with 1808 views | orfordbuoy |
Glad you showed the courage to bring this up; made many on here feel uncomfortable. The nub of this is Morsy's archaic, religious beliefs - which are behind him not giving a day's support to a repressed sector of our society. |  | | |
| Will our captain on 12:19 - Nov 30 with 1787 views | waveneyblue |
| Will our captain on 20:20 - Nov 29 by chicoazul |
I don’t know the answer, do you?
TWTD endlessly fascinates in turning its’ face away from uncomfortable issues with accusations of trolling. Perhaps there’s a German word for this phenomenon. |
There's a English word for tedious - Its Chicoazul |  | | |
| Will our captain on 12:19 - Nov 30 with 1785 views | bournemouthblue |
| Will our captain on 21:02 - Nov 29 by SitfcB |
Who cares if he doesn’t?
His choice.
No big deal. |
Indeed, would you get the same reaction if a player did that with the poppy?
I doubt it |  |
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| Will our captain on 13:22 - Nov 30 with 1669 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Will our captain on 12:19 - Nov 30 by bournemouthblue |
Indeed, would you get the same reaction if a player did that with the poppy?
I doubt it |
What a ridiculous comparison. | |
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| Will our captain on 13:24 - Nov 30 with 1667 views | strikalite |
| Will our captain on 12:19 - Nov 30 by bournemouthblue |
Indeed, would you get the same reaction if a player did that with the poppy?
I doubt it |
How about they take the pressure of choice away from individuals and just make a rainbow ball or something instead.. |  | | |
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