| Tory voter collapse 17:58 - Feb 9 with 3565 views | HARRY10 |
Righties, look away now
Todays poll (28,000) in the Telegraph
has
Lab 49% - 509 seats
Con 23% - 45 seats
Which would mean the SNP with 50 seats would be the official opposition. A measure of the collapse is this is their lowest polling since 1832.
The thought was that there would be a Sunak bounce, pushing up the percentage. This has not happened and the thought is that with the bloater re-surfacing along with the horror that was Truss voters have been reminded of the incompetence of Johnson and the loony ideas of Truss, so even more have abandoned them.
And this was before Lee Anderson was given his job. Equivilant to putting Mr G Glitter on the board of the local PTA, somemight suggest.
The other thought was that disatisfaction with theTories would lead to a swing to the Libdems. It has not. Just a straight swap to Labour. There could also be bigger swings to both Lab and Libdems as in 1997 due to swing voters - as with the past three Tory by-elections
Whatever the, it is going to take a long while to unpick and repair the damage caused by 13 years of Tory incompetence, mismanagement and failure to invest. Something akin to us after Evans some might suggest.
https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/politics/snap-general-election-would-leave-tor |  | | |  |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:17 - Feb 9 with 2841 views | Ftnfwest |
Can’t see labour following though with PR if that result happens! |  | | |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:21 - Feb 9 with 2821 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
The biggest problem is how long there is before the next General Election still. |  |
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| Tory voter collapse on 18:26 - Feb 9 with 2797 views | ITFC_Forever |
All that and Labour are missing an open goal by not pledging to reverse Brexit.
Edit: Now to not(!) [Post edited 10 Feb 2023 12:09]
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| Tory voter collapse on 18:27 - Feb 9 with 2786 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:21 - Feb 9 by Nthsuffolkblue |
The biggest problem is how long there is before the next General Election still. |
Quite. I wouldn’t get too excited just yet. |  |
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| Tory voter collapse on 18:29 - Feb 9 with 2781 views | BlueBadger |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:26 - Feb 9 by ITFC_Forever |
All that and Labour are missing an open goal by not pledging to reverse Brexit.
Edit: Now to not(!) [Post edited 10 Feb 2023 12:09]
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Sadly, it's still an utterly toxic political issue. I fear that the most deluded are going to have to be presented with a concrete picture of destruction(ie a decade of decline) before we can even visit that one. [Post edited 9 Feb 2023 18:58]
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| Tory voter collapse on 18:51 - Feb 9 with 2707 views | MattinLondon |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:29 - Feb 9 by BlueBadger |
Sadly, it's still an utterly toxic political issue. I fear that the most deluded are going to have to be presented with a concrete picture of destruction(ie a decade of decline) before we can even visit that one. [Post edited 9 Feb 2023 18:58]
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In ten years I think we will go back into the single market and ten years after that the issue of rejoining the EU will be discussed seriously. |  | | |
| Tory voter collapse on 19:15 - Feb 9 with 2612 views | NthQldITFC |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:26 - Feb 9 by ITFC_Forever |
All that and Labour are missing an open goal by not pledging to reverse Brexit.
Edit: Now to not(!) [Post edited 10 Feb 2023 12:09]
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Never was one errant letter more of a disappointment upon checking. |  |
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| Tory voter collapse on 19:29 - Feb 9 with 2562 views | Pendejo |
Please stop referring to the last 13 years of Tory Gov as - "incompetence, mismanagement" - everything has been done for a reason or million, usually siphoned off to self, family, chums and donors. It's all been very carefully planned and executed.
As will the finding of a reason not to hold a GE, or, more likely some sort of a!media inducing bribe to enough of the populace to vote them in again. |  |
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| Tory voter collapse on 19:39 - Feb 9 with 2531 views | HARRY10 |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:17 - Feb 9 by Ftnfwest |
Can’t see labour following though with PR if that result happens! |
Given that you would be removing a huge chunk of semocracy, taking away voter control and putting it into the hands of a few within each party I sdoubt any party is that daft
As an aside I was speaking with a handful in the pub over Xmas - and while all thought PR was great, none knew it meant you could not vote or for, or even select your candidate. None either understood how the coalition worked. All but one thought decisions were made on a sort of collective basis, qnd was rather deflated when it was explained that whatever the ciolition members would vote on party lines. As with 2010-15, LibLab late 70s you are back to the largest party running things as now.
As to brexit, as it is not in the given of any UK government to rejoin the EU (they have to agree) then there is little point in doing much at the moment. That is already happening elswhere, as it has been for the past three years plus. And it has almost become a daily news story whereby another industry complains about how brexit is harming them.
Society will not change overnight, just as with the smoking ban and dunk and driving - both now seen as social no-nos -where once any ban was seen as an infringement on civil liberties. Never mind the freedom of those killed by drink drivers or second hand smoke.
It will need the EU to invite the UK. Something I am sure is already being discussed with the EU by the progressive partys.
Yes, the GE could be nearly 2 years away, but the belief that the new PM 9Sunak) would change things and improve the Tory lot has proven incorrect. Better for them to get out and try to rebuilt, than to let things drag on with ever more scandal and the focus being on internal party fighting.
The danger in hanging on is that you harm the party structure - much of which is hanging on by a thread - with many left over from the Young Cinservatives boom time of the 50's.
Membership is less than a third of that of the Labour party and with higher numbers in the over 70s age group the need is to find new blood. Something unlikely as things stand.
The problem is whether the more normal members, decide to stay and fight off the ERG or head off to form a break away party that would attract donors, unlike the swivel eyed section. | | | |
| Tory voter collapse on 19:59 - Feb 9 with 2468 views | HARRY10 |
| Tory voter collapse on 19:29 - Feb 9 by Pendejo |
Please stop referring to the last 13 years of Tory Gov as - "incompetence, mismanagement" - everything has been done for a reason or million, usually siphoned off to self, family, chums and donors. It's all been very carefully planned and executed.
As will the finding of a reason not to hold a GE, or, more likely some sort of a!media inducing bribe to enough of the populace to vote them in again. |
Whilst there are undoubtely certain individuals and entities who have benefitted from decisions taken that does not mean any degree of competence, as with the almost weekly u-turns by the bloater.
His failure to attend COBRA meetings and the dismissal in the aerly days as flu smacks of gross incompetence. The failure and cost of PPE and Track and trace also.
As to some sort of 'cunning plan' that would gift them the next GE that has long since gone. Far from things getting better there is still worse to come. A fair number of folk have been making ends meet by using debt. That can only be taken so far.
The certaibty is a fall in house prices, the only question is by how far We are seeing a constant stream of pubs, restaurants and shops closing. The reasons may vary but it is the sitting government that is held to blame. Deliveroo are to cut 350 jobs, Nationwide 450, MC&C 1900 and the supposed boom in employment overlooks the fact that a quarter are now part time
The effect of higher mortgages, food and energy is disposal income decreases, so kess spend in oubs, restaurants, leisure etc
I cannot see any rabbits pulled out of the hat there. | | | |
| Tory voter collapse on 20:35 - Feb 9 with 2355 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| Tory voter collapse on 19:39 - Feb 9 by HARRY10 |
Given that you would be removing a huge chunk of semocracy, taking away voter control and putting it into the hands of a few within each party I sdoubt any party is that daft
As an aside I was speaking with a handful in the pub over Xmas - and while all thought PR was great, none knew it meant you could not vote or for, or even select your candidate. None either understood how the coalition worked. All but one thought decisions were made on a sort of collective basis, qnd was rather deflated when it was explained that whatever the ciolition members would vote on party lines. As with 2010-15, LibLab late 70s you are back to the largest party running things as now.
As to brexit, as it is not in the given of any UK government to rejoin the EU (they have to agree) then there is little point in doing much at the moment. That is already happening elswhere, as it has been for the past three years plus. And it has almost become a daily news story whereby another industry complains about how brexit is harming them.
Society will not change overnight, just as with the smoking ban and dunk and driving - both now seen as social no-nos -where once any ban was seen as an infringement on civil liberties. Never mind the freedom of those killed by drink drivers or second hand smoke.
It will need the EU to invite the UK. Something I am sure is already being discussed with the EU by the progressive partys.
Yes, the GE could be nearly 2 years away, but the belief that the new PM 9Sunak) would change things and improve the Tory lot has proven incorrect. Better for them to get out and try to rebuilt, than to let things drag on with ever more scandal and the focus being on internal party fighting.
The danger in hanging on is that you harm the party structure - much of which is hanging on by a thread - with many left over from the Young Cinservatives boom time of the 50's.
Membership is less than a third of that of the Labour party and with higher numbers in the over 70s age group the need is to find new blood. Something unlikely as things stand.
The problem is whether the more normal members, decide to stay and fight off the ERG or head off to form a break away party that would attract donors, unlike the swivel eyed section. |
Oh Harry...
You need to read up on the PR system used for the Scottish Parliament.
I know who my Constituency MSP is, and have contacted them about an issue. They were great. I also could have contacted one of the balancing list MSPs for my area.
There are several different systems in place across Western democracies. The Scottish one works very well. Certainly better than the horrendous, gerrymandered, corrupt, First-Past-the-Post system that ensures the Tories get in more often than not. | | | |
| Tory voter collapse on 20:57 - Feb 9 with 2248 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Tory voter collapse on 19:29 - Feb 9 by Pendejo |
Please stop referring to the last 13 years of Tory Gov as - "incompetence, mismanagement" - everything has been done for a reason or million, usually siphoned off to self, family, chums and donors. It's all been very carefully planned and executed.
As will the finding of a reason not to hold a GE, or, more likely some sort of a!media inducing bribe to enough of the populace to vote them in again. |
Yeah, there’s a long way to go yet for plenty of dirty tricks and bot farms to start targeting people with ads. It’s not like we haven’t been here before.
And they are indeed very efficient at extracting as much personal gain as possible from the system for themselves and friends. Their ‘incompetence’ even helps in this regard as the ministers will all be picking up extra payments and pensions however quickly they pass through the revolving door.
They are utterly sh*t at running the country though. Public service isn’t where their skill sets lie. | |
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| Tory voter collapse on 21:44 - Feb 9 with 2129 views | Pendejo |
| Tory voter collapse on 19:59 - Feb 9 by HARRY10 |
Whilst there are undoubtely certain individuals and entities who have benefitted from decisions taken that does not mean any degree of competence, as with the almost weekly u-turns by the bloater.
His failure to attend COBRA meetings and the dismissal in the aerly days as flu smacks of gross incompetence. The failure and cost of PPE and Track and trace also.
As to some sort of 'cunning plan' that would gift them the next GE that has long since gone. Far from things getting better there is still worse to come. A fair number of folk have been making ends meet by using debt. That can only be taken so far.
The certaibty is a fall in house prices, the only question is by how far We are seeing a constant stream of pubs, restaurants and shops closing. The reasons may vary but it is the sitting government that is held to blame. Deliveroo are to cut 350 jobs, Nationwide 450, MC&C 1900 and the supposed boom in employment overlooks the fact that a quarter are now part time
The effect of higher mortgages, food and energy is disposal income decreases, so kess spend in oubs, restaurants, leisure etc
I cannot see any rabbits pulled out of the hat there. |
Incompetence can be excused... the continual stealth privatisation of health service, the VIP lane to the gravy train was criminal, unforgivable and hopefully result in some serious repercussions..
Failure to attend COBRA not lack of competence per se, a case of not giving a sheet... "Let the bodies pile high" etc.
There's elements of cunning planning and elements of opportunistic profiteering and free loading.
Track and trace you say; successful operation to transfer funds from the public purse to the pockets of the already filthy rich.
A fall in house prices only really affects people looking to sell, and then whether it takes them into negative equity... anyway there's still plenty of folks living mortgage free who read The Sun, Mail and Express and will vote the way the press barons tell them to. Oh and those folks include a high number of pensioners, so job losses "not their problem". | |
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| Tory voter collapse on 22:04 - Feb 9 with 2088 views | HARRY10 |
| Tory voter collapse on 20:35 - Feb 9 by ArnoldMoorhen |
Oh Harry...
You need to read up on the PR system used for the Scottish Parliament.
I know who my Constituency MSP is, and have contacted them about an issue. They were great. I also could have contacted one of the balancing list MSPs for my area.
There are several different systems in place across Western democracies. The Scottish one works very well. Certainly better than the horrendous, gerrymandered, corrupt, First-Past-the-Post system that ensures the Tories get in more often than not. |
eh ?
Where did I claim that you would not know who my constiuency MP was ? I didn;t that was you just making up stuff, Which is an indication of your limted grasp on PR
What I sdid say was
"it meant you could not vote or for, or even select your candidate. "
quitre different
And still NO comment oin the fact that wiith PR it is still the largest party who decides. If Labour and the Libs firm a coalition after the next GE there will be more Lab MPs sitting round the cabinet that libs, so it will always be Lab who wins the vote on any measure.
The Liba will have to do as they did in 2010-15, this time go along with whatever Labour proposes..
What poeple like you are doing is bleating out a slogan, as with brexiters , that you don't understand but somehow imagine that it will make things better.. It will not.
How many Lib voters voted or the Tories in 2010 ? That decision was made by a handful of Tories and Libs. As the lib manefesto was dumped as they were used to prop up the Tories. This what happens with PR.
Or are we to belief that if one party wants to travel to London ands the other to Manchester, they agree to travel to Birmingham. No. The party with the most cabinet members wins, always. Just as happens now.
So try understanding your brief next time., | | | |
| Tory voter collapse on 22:32 - Feb 9 with 1942 views | giant_stow |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:26 - Feb 9 by ITFC_Forever |
All that and Labour are missing an open goal by not pledging to reverse Brexit.
Edit: Now to not(!) [Post edited 10 Feb 2023 12:09]
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Not so sure that is an open goal personally. People whove made the wrong decision can be very tricky to turn, but also, we've left the ideal half in / half out - what would the rejoining deal look like? Worse I'd imagine. Lastly, and not to sound like a dodgy old brexiter, but will the Eu still exist in a similar form by the time we get around to it? I could see it either being blown apart by inheritance financial flasks or that being solved, even more looking like a united States of Europe. |  |
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| Tory voter collapse on 02:40 - Feb 10 with 1820 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
| Tory voter collapse on 22:04 - Feb 9 by HARRY10 |
eh ?
Where did I claim that you would not know who my constiuency MP was ? I didn;t that was you just making up stuff, Which is an indication of your limted grasp on PR
What I sdid say was
"it meant you could not vote or for, or even select your candidate. "
quitre different
And still NO comment oin the fact that wiith PR it is still the largest party who decides. If Labour and the Libs firm a coalition after the next GE there will be more Lab MPs sitting round the cabinet that libs, so it will always be Lab who wins the vote on any measure.
The Liba will have to do as they did in 2010-15, this time go along with whatever Labour proposes..
What poeple like you are doing is bleating out a slogan, as with brexiters , that you don't understand but somehow imagine that it will make things better.. It will not.
How many Lib voters voted or the Tories in 2010 ? That decision was made by a handful of Tories and Libs. As the lib manefesto was dumped as they were used to prop up the Tories. This what happens with PR.
Or are we to belief that if one party wants to travel to London ands the other to Manchester, they agree to travel to Birmingham. No. The party with the most cabinet members wins, always. Just as happens now.
So try understanding your brief next time., |
I genuinely don't know what you are going on about in the majority of this post.
But I can assure you that Scottish voters vote for candidates in Constituencies in Scottish Parliament Elections, with Balancing List candidates who ensure that the end composition of the Scottish Parliament reflects the balance of votes cast significantly more accurately than the corrupt, gerrymandered First Past the Post Westminster system.
I fully understand the system I use to elect my MSP, thank you, not least because I have been to the Scottish Parliament and read the entire display dedicated to explaining it.
So, no, I am not ignorant. I have a pretty full grasp of the system by which I am enfranchised here in Scotland, and am also familiar with other PR systems, and alternative vote systems, for example the European Parliamentary Election system by which I used to be enfranchised.
I am aware that there are lots of "Harry haters" who jump on your every word, but I am not one of them. I have responded to your post on its merits. The plain reading of your recounting of your discussion in the pub with your friends is that you believe that PR elections do not allow for the election of named and known Constituency MPs, but the Scottish system, and others, are PR 2.0 or maybe 3.0, and have counteracted this weakness, and I believe your preconceptions to be based on earlier, simpler, forms of PR.
Please note that I have addressed your posts as fairly as I can, and whilst disagreeing with you, I haven't resorted to insults or personal name calling. | | | |
| Tory voter collapse on 07:17 - Feb 10 with 1698 views | Buhrer |
| Tory voter collapse on 22:04 - Feb 9 by HARRY10 |
eh ?
Where did I claim that you would not know who my constiuency MP was ? I didn;t that was you just making up stuff, Which is an indication of your limted grasp on PR
What I sdid say was
"it meant you could not vote or for, or even select your candidate. "
quitre different
And still NO comment oin the fact that wiith PR it is still the largest party who decides. If Labour and the Libs firm a coalition after the next GE there will be more Lab MPs sitting round the cabinet that libs, so it will always be Lab who wins the vote on any measure.
The Liba will have to do as they did in 2010-15, this time go along with whatever Labour proposes..
What poeple like you are doing is bleating out a slogan, as with brexiters , that you don't understand but somehow imagine that it will make things better.. It will not.
How many Lib voters voted or the Tories in 2010 ? That decision was made by a handful of Tories and Libs. As the lib manefesto was dumped as they were used to prop up the Tories. This what happens with PR.
Or are we to belief that if one party wants to travel to London ands the other to Manchester, they agree to travel to Birmingham. No. The party with the most cabinet members wins, always. Just as happens now.
So try understanding your brief next time., |
Eh? Try being understandably brief. |  | | |
| Tory voter collapse on 08:04 - Feb 10 with 1625 views | Churchman |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:29 - Feb 9 by BlueBadger |
Sadly, it's still an utterly toxic political issue. I fear that the most deluded are going to have to be presented with a concrete picture of destruction(ie a decade of decline) before we can even visit that one. [Post edited 9 Feb 2023 18:58]
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You are quite right. It is, yet the real toxicity is the disastrous effect it is having on the ordinary lives of this country’s people. There is literally no upside.
When the election happens, things will probably be considerably worse. My hope is that behind the scenes Starmer is looking to do something about it as soon as he can. |  | | |
| Tory voter collapse on 09:38 - Feb 10 with 1556 views | chicoazul |
| Tory voter collapse on 19:39 - Feb 9 by HARRY10 |
Given that you would be removing a huge chunk of semocracy, taking away voter control and putting it into the hands of a few within each party I sdoubt any party is that daft
As an aside I was speaking with a handful in the pub over Xmas - and while all thought PR was great, none knew it meant you could not vote or for, or even select your candidate. None either understood how the coalition worked. All but one thought decisions were made on a sort of collective basis, qnd was rather deflated when it was explained that whatever the ciolition members would vote on party lines. As with 2010-15, LibLab late 70s you are back to the largest party running things as now.
As to brexit, as it is not in the given of any UK government to rejoin the EU (they have to agree) then there is little point in doing much at the moment. That is already happening elswhere, as it has been for the past three years plus. And it has almost become a daily news story whereby another industry complains about how brexit is harming them.
Society will not change overnight, just as with the smoking ban and dunk and driving - both now seen as social no-nos -where once any ban was seen as an infringement on civil liberties. Never mind the freedom of those killed by drink drivers or second hand smoke.
It will need the EU to invite the UK. Something I am sure is already being discussed with the EU by the progressive partys.
Yes, the GE could be nearly 2 years away, but the belief that the new PM 9Sunak) would change things and improve the Tory lot has proven incorrect. Better for them to get out and try to rebuilt, than to let things drag on with ever more scandal and the focus being on internal party fighting.
The danger in hanging on is that you harm the party structure - much of which is hanging on by a thread - with many left over from the Young Cinservatives boom time of the 50's.
Membership is less than a third of that of the Labour party and with higher numbers in the over 70s age group the need is to find new blood. Something unlikely as things stand.
The problem is whether the more normal members, decide to stay and fight off the ERG or head off to form a break away party that would attract donors, unlike the swivel eyed section. |
Trouble is Harold many of those Labour members joined because of the Maximum Leader, who is now in permanent exile on an allotment in Islington. |  |
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| Tory voter collapse on 10:20 - Feb 10 with 1474 views | blueasfook |
Polls Shmolls. The polls never predicted Corbyn's Clown Party getting a royal spanking at the last election but nevertheless they did.
What people say they will do and what they actually do are quite often different things. |  |
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| Tory voter collapse on 11:53 - Feb 10 with 1393 views | cooperd5 |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:26 - Feb 9 by ITFC_Forever |
All that and Labour are missing an open goal by not pledging to reverse Brexit.
Edit: Now to not(!) [Post edited 10 Feb 2023 12:09]
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I think a long-game is being played as if Labour say they will re-join it will just stir up all the R/W hatred and racism even more with "they're stealing your brexit!" and "they're ignoring the will of the people!" cries.... |  | | |
| Tory voter collapse on 11:56 - Feb 10 with 1387 views | GlasgowBlue |
FYI
West Lancs: Lab hold; swing to Lab 10.5%, same as Stretford & Urmston. Not a big enough swing to produce a Lab majority in a general election, but easily enough for a Lab minority govt in a hung parliament. Although the swing in a general election is always lower than the average in a by-election. |  |
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| Tory voter collapse on 12:03 - Feb 10 with 1366 views | Radlett_blue |
| Tory voter collapse on 18:26 - Feb 9 by ITFC_Forever |
All that and Labour are missing an open goal by not pledging to reverse Brexit.
Edit: Now to not(!) [Post edited 10 Feb 2023 12:09]
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The UK is & always has been very divided on the EU & Brexit. Promising to reverse it would be a decision so politically naive & stupid that I'm amazed anyone with any intelligence can think it's a good idea politically. THe debate over whether the UK should have left is a completely different matter. All Starmer needs to do is what he's doing now "Nuffink", as Michael Caine would say & victory will fall into his lap, unless there's a huge economic rebound over the next 18 months. But don't get too swayed by mid term polls - answering an opinion poll now is a very different thing from electing a government 18 months down the road. Labour are still likely to win a handsome majority, but I doubt it will be the massacre predicted by the current polls. |  |
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| Tory voter collapse on 12:38 - Feb 10 with 1290 views | bluelagos |
| Tory voter collapse on 11:56 - Feb 10 by GlasgowBlue |
FYI
West Lancs: Lab hold; swing to Lab 10.5%, same as Stretford & Urmston. Not a big enough swing to produce a Lab majority in a general election, but easily enough for a Lab minority govt in a hung parliament. Although the swing in a general election is always lower than the average in a by-election. |
From today's politico email:
"Britain Elects’ polling model for the New Statesman, which anticipated the result almost perfectly, claims a similar swing at a general election today would hand Labour 424 seats and the Tories 138. (There are, as always, many caveats to this.)" |  |
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| Tory voter collapse on 13:41 - Feb 10 with 1217 views | Ryorry |
| Tory voter collapse on 19:39 - Feb 9 by HARRY10 |
Given that you would be removing a huge chunk of semocracy, taking away voter control and putting it into the hands of a few within each party I sdoubt any party is that daft
As an aside I was speaking with a handful in the pub over Xmas - and while all thought PR was great, none knew it meant you could not vote or for, or even select your candidate. None either understood how the coalition worked. All but one thought decisions were made on a sort of collective basis, qnd was rather deflated when it was explained that whatever the ciolition members would vote on party lines. As with 2010-15, LibLab late 70s you are back to the largest party running things as now.
As to brexit, as it is not in the given of any UK government to rejoin the EU (they have to agree) then there is little point in doing much at the moment. That is already happening elswhere, as it has been for the past three years plus. And it has almost become a daily news story whereby another industry complains about how brexit is harming them.
Society will not change overnight, just as with the smoking ban and dunk and driving - both now seen as social no-nos -where once any ban was seen as an infringement on civil liberties. Never mind the freedom of those killed by drink drivers or second hand smoke.
It will need the EU to invite the UK. Something I am sure is already being discussed with the EU by the progressive partys.
Yes, the GE could be nearly 2 years away, but the belief that the new PM 9Sunak) would change things and improve the Tory lot has proven incorrect. Better for them to get out and try to rebuilt, than to let things drag on with ever more scandal and the focus being on internal party fighting.
The danger in hanging on is that you harm the party structure - much of which is hanging on by a thread - with many left over from the Young Cinservatives boom time of the 50's.
Membership is less than a third of that of the Labour party and with higher numbers in the over 70s age group the need is to find new blood. Something unlikely as things stand.
The problem is whether the more normal members, decide to stay and fight off the ERG or head off to form a break away party that would attract donors, unlike the swivel eyed section. |
Well Johnson certainly knew all about "semocracy" 🤪 |  |
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