| Insulate Britain - wow 14:23 - Oct 4 with 18196 views | galacticoblue |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:58 - Oct 4 with 1500 views | giant_stow |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:55 - Oct 4 by bluelagos |
Yep. I think there is every chance the govt will be more likely to address the levels of energy waste in the UK as a result. |
Seriously?
I see no evidence of that myself. The govt is populist by nature - siding with these campaigners is the opposite of that. |  |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:01 - Oct 4 with 1495 views | textbackup |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:52 - Oct 4 by bluelagos |
No.
In the past 6 years, since retiring I have taken less than one trip per year by plane. |
And if you were en route to that one holiday, after saving up, working hard, getting excited, you missed the flight because of this drips, you’d happily sit and think ‘oh well they are trying’ |  |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:03 - Oct 4 with 1482 views | bluelagos |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:56 - Oct 4 by giant_stow |
There's actually no indication (yet) that this is an effective campaign and I would argue it's actually hardening hearts and minds against their cause.. |
Some people are hardening their attitudes, for sure. But do you think any of the posters on here (some on this thread doing exactly that) for a minute are remotely bothered about the issues being discussed?
I would simply argue people are talking more about the need to address the environmental issues, because of these and other protests. Whether that actually leads to politicians making the necessary policy changes, or are ultimately a waste of time, only time will tell. |  |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:12 - Oct 4 with 1455 views | gtsb1966 |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:03 - Oct 4 by bluelagos |
Some people are hardening their attitudes, for sure. But do you think any of the posters on here (some on this thread doing exactly that) for a minute are remotely bothered about the issues being discussed?
I would simply argue people are talking more about the need to address the environmental issues, because of these and other protests. Whether that actually leads to politicians making the necessary policy changes, or are ultimately a waste of time, only time will tell. |
It's all about the timing. Covid has stopped people going to see loved ones, stopped people earning a living , stopped people having their freedom and just as things are slowly getting back to normal these people are stopping people doing things again. The country is fed up, apprehensive about what the next year or two holds and in some cases angry. Now is not the time to antagonise people further. |  | | |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:12 - Oct 4 with 1443 views | Churchman |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:38 - Oct 4 by giant_stow |
I think one of the problems is that they're attacking not the govt, but the people that they need to convince.
There must be more effective ways of persuading and influencing surely?
The nobleness of the cause isn't in doubt - its the methodology which is probably actually damaging the cause now. |
Spot on.
I’m sick and tired of these sorts of people using blackmail to push forward their agenda. Stopping people including emergency services going about their business disgusts me. What the heck have people going from A to B got to do with whatever their so called cause is?
They know that the innocent people whose lives they are messing with can’t drive over them or remove them in the way I’d like to. It’s little different to kidnapping a few strangers and detaining them until you get what you want.
Organsised protests, lobbying MPs, rallies in Hyde Park, all that stuff is fine. As a union member I know all about industrial action and legally withdrawing your labour - also fine. Inconveniencing or harming others on the laughable justification that the planet is more important is not fine. |  | | |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:17 - Oct 4 with 1422 views | Clapham_Junction |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:38 - Oct 4 by giant_stow |
I think one of the problems is that they're attacking not the govt, but the people that they need to convince.
There must be more effective ways of persuading and influencing surely?
The nobleness of the cause isn't in doubt - its the methodology which is probably actually damaging the cause now. |
People have been trying to get the government to properly fund insulation programmes for nearly a decade. They cut the last effective, large-scale one in around 2012 (which caused insulation installs to drop 97%!) and since then have overseen a string of policy failures, including numerous backwards steps like abolishing zero carbon homes, ruining the ECO scheme (the only one that has ever properly addressed solid wall insulation), or running absolute sh1tshows like the Green Homes Grant.
They've been told relentlessly by people in local government and the energy industry that they need to do something for so long, and nothing has happened. This is why people have ended up doing protests like this. |  | | |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:19 - Oct 4 with 1408 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:12 - Oct 4 by Churchman |
Spot on.
I’m sick and tired of these sorts of people using blackmail to push forward their agenda. Stopping people including emergency services going about their business disgusts me. What the heck have people going from A to B got to do with whatever their so called cause is?
They know that the innocent people whose lives they are messing with can’t drive over them or remove them in the way I’d like to. It’s little different to kidnapping a few strangers and detaining them until you get what you want.
Organsised protests, lobbying MPs, rallies in Hyde Park, all that stuff is fine. As a union member I know all about industrial action and legally withdrawing your labour - also fine. Inconveniencing or harming others on the laughable justification that the planet is more important is not fine. |
If they’re targeting emergency services, that’s not on and won’t help their cause one bit. To suggest it’s laughable that the planet is more important than us is laughable in itself though. Of course the planet is more important. All life literally depends on it. |  |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:20 - Oct 4 with 1399 views | J2BLUE |
W@nkers. Credit to the people dragging them out of the road. |  |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:21 - Oct 4 with 1392 views | J2BLUE |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 15:33 - Oct 4 by tractordownsouth |
Performative campaigning is one of my biggest pet hates. These w@nkers know that they turn the public away from the worthy cause of environmentalism but they're so overdosed on their moral superiority that they're willing to put this woman through immense stress because they're convinced that everyone else is beneath them. |
they're so overdosed on their moral superiority that they're willing to put this woman through immense stress because they're convinced that everyone else is beneath them.
So Chico is right, it IS like TWTD... | |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:33 - Oct 4 with 1336 views | chicoazul |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:53 - Oct 4 by Keno |
Ireland should be belong to the Irish people but a quarter of it remains occupied by a foreign power. |
There are many Irish people who would disagree with you but I don’t think this thread is the place for that argument even if you are wrong. |  |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:36 - Oct 4 with 1325 views | Decoy_Octopus |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:38 - Oct 4 by giant_stow |
I think one of the problems is that they're attacking not the govt, but the people that they need to convince.
There must be more effective ways of persuading and influencing surely?
The nobleness of the cause isn't in doubt - its the methodology which is probably actually damaging the cause now. |
I agree, watching the videos today of the protesters being forcibly removed by drivers to try and let an ambulance through, it's not going to be long until someone is angry enough to just plow through or someone is seriously hurt. |  | | |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:37 - Oct 4 with 1313 views | Keno |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:33 - Oct 4 by chicoazul |
There are many Irish people who would disagree with you but I don’t think this thread is the place for that argument even if you are wrong. |
The majority of all Irish people would probably agree with me tho.
I'm not wrong, just Irish |  |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:40 - Oct 4 with 1300 views | ZXBlue |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:37 - Oct 4 by Keno |
The majority of all Irish people would probably agree with me tho.
I'm not wrong, just Irish |
The majority in the area in question wouldn't.
Which seems like the important bit. | | | |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:44 - Oct 4 with 1274 views | Ryorry |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:45 - Oct 4 by bluelagos |
The issue is Ulla - and I have asked this countless times and no one on here has ever given a coherent answer - is tell me a method of protest, that achieves change, without p*ssing people off.
As one of those guys said, we've been writing letters and signing petitions for years.
Answer me that, and I'll happily jump on the band wagon condemning these guys in the knowledge that there is an alternative effective way of ensuring our politicians take the steps to ensure we protect our planet future - without anoying ordinary people.
Am all ears... I really am. |
I've said it before several times incl on here - why aren't these protesters sitting themselves down where it *really matters*, and inconveniencing the only people who have the decision making powers to actually *do* something to speed up the home insulation programme - namely MPs & Lords in the environs of the HoP - Parliament Square etc.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Parliament+Square,+London/@51.4998305,-0.12537
As it is, they're shooting themselves in the feet by stopping ordinary people, who they need onside, from getting to hospital, to funerals, to work (incl NHS dentist just interviewed who had to cancel several emergency appts. with patients in acute pain this a.m.). |  |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:45 - Oct 4 with 1262 views | Keno |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:40 - Oct 4 by ZXBlue |
The majority in the area in question wouldn't.
Which seems like the important bit. |
Thats potential not still the case, which is why the Unionists arent happy with the Brexit changes
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-43823506
also why cant everyone in Ireland vote on what happens in Ireland? | |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:54 - Oct 4 with 1236 views | ZXBlue |
Its certainly edging closer. But given that the current arrangement is power sharing and open border, its difficult to see why Unionists should demand any less even when / if they become outnumbered. | | | |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:55 - Oct 4 with 1237 views | Darth_Koont |
We’ll have to see how history judges this.
The thing about civil disobedience is that it requires people to sit up and take notice in a way that only rioting would otherwise do. I would say that’s worth it for plenty of civil rights, anti-war demos and other protests throughout the years.
I mean the guy in Tiananmen Square wasn’t just selfishly trying to stop a tank driver getting home to his wife and kids. |  |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:56 - Oct 4 with 1224 views | bluelagos |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:44 - Oct 4 by Ryorry |
I've said it before several times incl on here - why aren't these protesters sitting themselves down where it *really matters*, and inconveniencing the only people who have the decision making powers to actually *do* something to speed up the home insulation programme - namely MPs & Lords in the environs of the HoP - Parliament Square etc.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Parliament+Square,+London/@51.4998305,-0.12537
As it is, they're shooting themselves in the feet by stopping ordinary people, who they need onside, from getting to hospital, to funerals, to work (incl NHS dentist just interviewed who had to cancel several emergency appts. with patients in acute pain this a.m.). |
I agree that sit downs outside parliament are more likely to be effective that on the M25 in impacting the actual decision makers. | |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:59 - Oct 4 with 1197 views | Darth_Koont |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:17 - Oct 4 by Clapham_Junction |
People have been trying to get the government to properly fund insulation programmes for nearly a decade. They cut the last effective, large-scale one in around 2012 (which caused insulation installs to drop 97%!) and since then have overseen a string of policy failures, including numerous backwards steps like abolishing zero carbon homes, ruining the ECO scheme (the only one that has ever properly addressed solid wall insulation), or running absolute sh1tshows like the Green Homes Grant.
They've been told relentlessly by people in local government and the energy industry that they need to do something for so long, and nothing has happened. This is why people have ended up doing protests like this. |
Indeed.
Obviously the only acceptable answer of what they should do now is grow up and just ignore this stuff like everyone else. | |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:59 - Oct 4 with 1195 views | StochesStotasBlewe |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:44 - Oct 4 by Ryorry |
I've said it before several times incl on here - why aren't these protesters sitting themselves down where it *really matters*, and inconveniencing the only people who have the decision making powers to actually *do* something to speed up the home insulation programme - namely MPs & Lords in the environs of the HoP - Parliament Square etc.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Parliament+Square,+London/@51.4998305,-0.12537
As it is, they're shooting themselves in the feet by stopping ordinary people, who they need onside, from getting to hospital, to funerals, to work (incl NHS dentist just interviewed who had to cancel several emergency appts. with patients in acute pain this a.m.). |
Simple answer. Plod would come down on them like a ton of bricks if they inconvenience those that have the power to do anything.
I agree with the principle, but the methods being employed currently are alienating the population at large. |  |
| We have no village green, or a shop.
It's very, very quiet.
I can walk to the pub. |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 18:20 - Oct 4 with 1136 views | Crawfordsboot |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:27 - Oct 4 by bluelagos |
Imagine being more outraged at the frustrations of commuters / delays caused by environmental protesters than by the ongoing environmental destruction that is occuring on our planet.
Destruction that causes people not to be late for meetings, or to see a relative in hospital, but environmental catastrophe that causes people to die.
If you think I am being simplistic, have a read up of the causes of the conflict in Darfur, and how desertification was a key part in that conflict that is estimated to have cost upwards of 300k lives.
Insulate Britain continue to protest at great personal cost/danger. I for one won't be condemning them, rather listening to them, to their message and recognising that in the big scheme of things, they are the ones on the right side of the environmental argument.
They will undoubtedly p*ss off a lot of people, just like many protesters in history have. That's kind of the point of direct action protesting, to bring to the front of people's minds the need for change. |
This has been touched on in earlier debates on here regarding direct action. There is no absolute black and white answer.
The right to protest is quite properly sacrosanct however with direct action it all comes down to what degree of direct action is acceptable. While many would think it acceptable to blockade access to BP headquarters for a day how many people think it acceptable to fly a plane into a skyscraper in New York. These are examples at opposite ends of the direct action spectrum but they are both direct action designed to grab attention.
At what point on the spectrum would you say enough is enough Lagos? |  | | |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 18:24 - Oct 4 with 1117 views | lowhouseblue |
they are of course right - retro-fitting insulation is a quick and cost effective way to reduce emissions and it creates jobs. sadly i don't know what more that could do to shut the public's ears to what they're saying. self righteous idiots. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 18:47 - Oct 4 with 1061 views | Keno |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 17:54 - Oct 4 by ZXBlue |
Its certainly edging closer. But given that the current arrangement is power sharing and open border, its difficult to see why Unionists should demand any less even when / if they become outnumbered. |
I fear that it could turn very nasty again
the pre brexit tweets by Patrick Keilty summed it up very well | |
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| Insulate Britain - wow on 19:09 - Oct 4 with 996 views | yesjohn99 |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 16:52 - Oct 4 by bluelagos |
No.
In the past 6 years, since retiring I have taken less than one trip per year by plane. |
Cosmic. So you’ve had all your fun but now we’re not allowed to have ours.
Thanks. | | | |
| Insulate Britain - wow on 19:22 - Oct 4 with 952 views | ArnoldMoorhen |
As you know, they can, and one day will. But a majority will need to exist in both Eire and Northern Ireland for there to be a change in the current "One Island - either/or/and nationality" solution, according to the Belfast/Good Friday Agreement.
That's if the Belfast/Good Friday Agreement survives Boris and co pulling an Article 16 manoeuvre regarding the Northern Ireland Trade Protocol. Or survives Sammy Wilson's anger if he doesn't. | | | |
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