| Cancel culture 08:25 - Jul 8 with 17078 views | hampstead_blue |
Interesting and good that people with a voice are standing up to this.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-53330105
A lawyer on Today even floated the idea of cancelling ALL historical statues, paintings, and physical memorials because 'standards change and people whom today seem great may be hiding dark secrets'
Bonkers.
Am all for free speech. Owen Jones and his cabal can scream "offence" until their lungs turn inside out. Makes my blood boil if you hadn't guessed. |  |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
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| Cancel culture on 13:22 - Jul 8 with 1426 views | Ryorry |
| Cancel culture on 12:44 - Jul 8 by LankHenners |
The thing is, no-one is dismissing acts of harassment and violence against women, but people like Rowling assume they are so they can clear the decks for their argument whilst painting anyone with opposing views as hypocritical or otherwise nefarious.
Whilst there are grey areas in the complexities of these conversations (sport, which is split into ‘men’ and ‘women’ being a major one), a lot of the arguments around safe spaces and protecting women are made in bad faith. To be blunt, a sexual assaulter won’t need a sign on a toilet door to stop them assaulting someone. A lot of failings of other people or institutions are often pushed, by Rowling etc., onto trans people. To take an example from earlier in the thread, men using transitioning as an excuse to be put in a women’s prison and then assaulting women in there is a failing of the legal and prison systems to take care of those situations properly. |
Sticking to the fundamental issue of safe spaces for women, & leaving out the rights/wrongs of views of individual "personalities" -
Your saying "To be blunt, a sexual assaulter won’t need a sign on a toilet door to stop them assaulting someone" whilst factually accurate in itself, is a red herring. There's a vast difference between the very rare occasions when a male might do this (and in all likelihood be spotted going in with the alarm quickly raised); and men dressed as women being freely allowed in and women having to be constantly on their guard & fearful. |  |
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| Cancel culture on 13:23 - Jul 8 with 1416 views | Libero |
| Cancel culture on 13:22 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
Sticking to the fundamental issue of safe spaces for women, & leaving out the rights/wrongs of views of individual "personalities" -
Your saying "To be blunt, a sexual assaulter won’t need a sign on a toilet door to stop them assaulting someone" whilst factually accurate in itself, is a red herring. There's a vast difference between the very rare occasions when a male might do this (and in all likelihood be spotted going in with the alarm quickly raised); and men dressed as women being freely allowed in and women having to be constantly on their guard & fearful. |
Your skirting (excuse the pun) into Daily Mail trans-phobic whatabouttery. |  | | |
| Cancel culture on 13:43 - Jul 8 with 1364 views | Ryorry |
| Cancel culture on 13:23 - Jul 8 by Libero |
Your skirting (excuse the pun) into Daily Mail trans-phobic whatabouttery. |
Thank you Libero and Herbivore for proving my point. | |
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| Cancel culture on 13:44 - Jul 8 with 1358 views | Libero |
| Cancel culture on 13:43 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
Thank you Libero and Herbivore for proving my point. |
Could you elaborate how exactly I've proven your point? | | | |
| Cancel culture on 13:47 - Jul 8 with 1341 views | Ryorry |
| Cancel culture on 13:44 - Jul 8 by Libero |
Could you elaborate how exactly I've proven your point? |
I've described the actual experiences and feelings of tens of millions of women, inluding myself. You've dismissed that as "Daily Mail trans-phobic whatabouttery". | |
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| Cancel culture on 13:49 - Jul 8 with 1329 views | Libero |
| Cancel culture on 13:47 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
I've described the actual experiences and feelings of tens of millions of women, inluding myself. You've dismissed that as "Daily Mail trans-phobic whatabouttery". |
I'm sorry that you feel dismissed, but showing that level of prejudice about trans people is "Daily Mail trans-phobic whatabouttery"
If I was to say the same about a gay bloke in the men's toilets I'd be quite rightly called a bigot. | | | |
| Cancel culture on 13:52 - Jul 8 with 1299 views | tractordownsouth |
Saying women need "safe spaces" away from trans people, therefore implying they're perverts/abusers, is exactly the same stuff that homphobes were saying about gay people 20 years ago. |  |
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| Cancel culture on 13:55 - Jul 8 with 1284 views | Herbivore |
| Cancel culture on 13:47 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
I've described the actual experiences and feelings of tens of millions of women, inluding myself. You've dismissed that as "Daily Mail trans-phobic whatabouttery". |
You speak for tens of millions of women? Blimey, I didn't know we had the official spokesperson of womankind on here. Apologies for not treating your opinion as merely your opinion as opposed to the official position of women everywhere.
Also, see what Libby said and my previous point regarding the access of gay men to male spaces. It's a similar thing and concerns along those lines tend to be motivated by homophobia or transphobia. There is no evidence that there is a significant issue with trans women assaulting cis women in changing rooms and toilets, and yet some women (or all, perhaps you can confirm for us) treat it as though it is a major threat. |  |
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| Cancel culture on 13:55 - Jul 8 with 1279 views | Ryorry |
| Cancel culture on 13:49 - Jul 8 by Libero |
I'm sorry that you feel dismissed, but showing that level of prejudice about trans people is "Daily Mail trans-phobic whatabouttery"
If I was to say the same about a gay bloke in the men's toilets I'd be quite rightly called a bigot. |
I haven't shown any "level of prejudice about trans people", indeed I clearly stated "Of course the majority of trans people are perfectly harmless, but there will also be some men, not genuine trans, who simply see the situation as an opportunity to attack women."
If you take the trouble to speak with (or ask on any forum) a sample of say 100 women, I'm pretty sure that you'll find nearly all, if not all of them, have never felt remotely threatened by lesbians in a female toilet - in fact the thought of that had never even occurred to me till now. There are some pretty obvious biological differences between biological women and trans born as men. | |
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| Cancel culture on 14:03 - Jul 8 with 1249 views | Libero |
| Cancel culture on 13:55 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
I haven't shown any "level of prejudice about trans people", indeed I clearly stated "Of course the majority of trans people are perfectly harmless, but there will also be some men, not genuine trans, who simply see the situation as an opportunity to attack women."
If you take the trouble to speak with (or ask on any forum) a sample of say 100 women, I'm pretty sure that you'll find nearly all, if not all of them, have never felt remotely threatened by lesbians in a female toilet - in fact the thought of that had never even occurred to me till now. There are some pretty obvious biological differences between biological women and trans born as men. |
I think Herbs, TBDS and myself have all highlighted the kind of prejudice you're showing, if you can't acknowledge it that's fine but your insinuations and speculations illustrate it perfectly.
I am sorry to be blunt as I know you don't respond well to being challenged, but you're talking rubbish and trying to justify it by claiming other women are with you, I do not disbelieve that there are other ignorant women with a bizarre fear of trans women who feel the same as you, in fact I'm sure of it, this does not validate your views. [Post edited 8 Jul 2020 14:09]
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| Cancel culture on 14:07 - Jul 8 with 1232 views | tractordownsouth |
| Cancel culture on 13:55 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
I haven't shown any "level of prejudice about trans people", indeed I clearly stated "Of course the majority of trans people are perfectly harmless, but there will also be some men, not genuine trans, who simply see the situation as an opportunity to attack women."
If you take the trouble to speak with (or ask on any forum) a sample of say 100 women, I'm pretty sure that you'll find nearly all, if not all of them, have never felt remotely threatened by lesbians in a female toilet - in fact the thought of that had never even occurred to me till now. There are some pretty obvious biological differences between biological women and trans born as men. |
Assaults sadly happen all the time, but banning people from public spaces won't do that. That's the same argument as saying a few Muslims are terrorists so we should ban them all.
I'm sure that's not how you're trying to come across, but what would be your solution? I think the fear has partly been driven by media hysteria, and the trans debate has been hijacked by ridiculous hyperbole such as "what if i identify as an elephant and live in a zoo?" from the likes of Piers Morgan. | |
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| Cancel culture on 14:10 - Jul 8 with 1204 views | Ryorry |
| Cancel culture on 14:03 - Jul 8 by Libero |
I think Herbs, TBDS and myself have all highlighted the kind of prejudice you're showing, if you can't acknowledge it that's fine but your insinuations and speculations illustrate it perfectly.
I am sorry to be blunt as I know you don't respond well to being challenged, but you're talking rubbish and trying to justify it by claiming other women are with you, I do not disbelieve that there are other ignorant women with a bizarre fear of trans women who feel the same as you, in fact I'm sure of it, this does not validate your views. [Post edited 8 Jul 2020 14:09]
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Jeezus - your own words, as can be read by any person reading *objectively* here in relation to *what I've actually said* on this thread, say everything that needs to be said about your own attitude, particularly towards me.
I've nothing further to say to you, you're just wasting my time. | |
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| Cancel culture on 14:10 - Jul 8 with 1203 views | SpruceMoose |
| Cancel culture on 14:07 - Jul 8 by tractordownsouth |
Assaults sadly happen all the time, but banning people from public spaces won't do that. That's the same argument as saying a few Muslims are terrorists so we should ban them all.
I'm sure that's not how you're trying to come across, but what would be your solution? I think the fear has partly been driven by media hysteria, and the trans debate has been hijacked by ridiculous hyperbole such as "what if i identify as an elephant and live in a zoo?" from the likes of Piers Morgan. |
If Morgan is to live in the zoo can we keep in him the Tiger enclosure please? |  |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Cancel culture on 14:11 - Jul 8 with 1200 views | Libero |
| Cancel culture on 14:10 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
Jeezus - your own words, as can be read by any person reading *objectively* here in relation to *what I've actually said* on this thread, say everything that needs to be said about your own attitude, particularly towards me.
I've nothing further to say to you, you're just wasting my time. |
While I was mindful of how to challenge your views due to our history, this quite literally has nothing to do with you, I'm discussing the subject with you as I would any one else. *sighs* [Post edited 8 Jul 2020 14:13]
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| Cancel culture on 14:14 - Jul 8 with 1181 views | Ryorry |
| Cancel culture on 14:07 - Jul 8 by tractordownsouth |
Assaults sadly happen all the time, but banning people from public spaces won't do that. That's the same argument as saying a few Muslims are terrorists so we should ban them all.
I'm sure that's not how you're trying to come across, but what would be your solution? I think the fear has partly been driven by media hysteria, and the trans debate has been hijacked by ridiculous hyperbole such as "what if i identify as an elephant and live in a zoo?" from the likes of Piers Morgan. |
My own solution would actually be a 4th toilet - m, f, disabled & trans. Expensive I know.
"I think the fear has partly been driven by media hysteria". Yes, true, but I've also read plenty of forums & social media platforms where literally millions of individual women have said exactly the same as me - and before it became something the tabloids ramped up. | |
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| Cancel culture on 14:19 - Jul 8 with 1158 views | tractordownsouth |
| Cancel culture on 14:14 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
My own solution would actually be a 4th toilet - m, f, disabled & trans. Expensive I know.
"I think the fear has partly been driven by media hysteria". Yes, true, but I've also read plenty of forums & social media platforms where literally millions of individual women have said exactly the same as me - and before it became something the tabloids ramped up. |
Fair enough, at least you've given a solution.
I think eventually attitudes will shift. The fact we went from Homosexuality being illegal to Civil Partnerships and Gay Marriage in less than 50 years makes me think that this won't even be an issue in 10 or 20 years. | |
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| Cancel culture on 14:21 - Jul 8 with 1152 views | lowhouseblue |
| Cancel culture on 13:55 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
I haven't shown any "level of prejudice about trans people", indeed I clearly stated "Of course the majority of trans people are perfectly harmless, but there will also be some men, not genuine trans, who simply see the situation as an opportunity to attack women."
If you take the trouble to speak with (or ask on any forum) a sample of say 100 women, I'm pretty sure that you'll find nearly all, if not all of them, have never felt remotely threatened by lesbians in a female toilet - in fact the thought of that had never even occurred to me till now. There are some pretty obvious biological differences between biological women and trans born as men. |
what you're failing to grasp is that biological women don't exist any more, at least not as a category that matters. any one can now be a woman. it is the ultimate culmination of misogyny - define away biological women as an irrelevance and tell them to shut up. just another way in which people with penises get to set the rules. hurrah. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Cancel culture on 14:21 - Jul 8 with 1151 views | SpruceMoose |
| Cancel culture on 14:14 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
My own solution would actually be a 4th toilet - m, f, disabled & trans. Expensive I know.
"I think the fear has partly been driven by media hysteria". Yes, true, but I've also read plenty of forums & social media platforms where literally millions of individual women have said exactly the same as me - and before it became something the tabloids ramped up. |
I just wanted to say that obviously disabled bathrooms are needed because disabled people often have physical limitations that make using regular bathrooms difficult. They aren't provided so abled-bodied people have a bathroom space free of disabled people.
Making Trans people use a different bathroom does rather smack, to me at least, of segregation along the lines of separate water fountains and bus seats for Black people. Separate bathrooms for Trans people would most likely just marginalise and isolate Trans people in public even more than they currently are. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Cancel culture on 14:22 - Jul 8 with 1137 views | Libero |
| Cancel culture on 14:21 - Jul 8 by SpruceMoose |
I just wanted to say that obviously disabled bathrooms are needed because disabled people often have physical limitations that make using regular bathrooms difficult. They aren't provided so abled-bodied people have a bathroom space free of disabled people.
Making Trans people use a different bathroom does rather smack, to me at least, of segregation along the lines of separate water fountains and bus seats for Black people. Separate bathrooms for Trans people would most likely just marginalise and isolate Trans people in public even more than they currently are. |
Frankly, it's disgusting. | | | |
| Cancel culture on 14:23 - Jul 8 with 1129 views | SpruceMoose |
| Cancel culture on 14:21 - Jul 8 by lowhouseblue |
what you're failing to grasp is that biological women don't exist any more, at least not as a category that matters. any one can now be a woman. it is the ultimate culmination of misogyny - define away biological women as an irrelevance and tell them to shut up. just another way in which people with penises get to set the rules. hurrah. |
Stick to your village hall echo chamber as you clearly have no insight into matters like this.
You've massively embarrassed yourself with that last post but no doubt you'll be too arrogant see it. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Cancel culture on 14:24 - Jul 8 with 1121 views | tractordownsouth |
| Cancel culture on 14:21 - Jul 8 by lowhouseblue |
what you're failing to grasp is that biological women don't exist any more, at least not as a category that matters. any one can now be a woman. it is the ultimate culmination of misogyny - define away biological women as an irrelevance and tell them to shut up. just another way in which people with penises get to set the rules. hurrah. |
It's really not misogyny... | |
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| Cancel culture on 14:27 - Jul 8 with 1093 views | lowhouseblue |
defining biological women away as a significant category - i can't think of anything more misogynist to be honest. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Cancel culture on 14:28 - Jul 8 with 1080 views | Libero |
| Cancel culture on 14:25 - Jul 8 by Ryorry |
That is utterly disgusting, and to attach that kind of disgusting in any way to me is utterly beyond the pale. |
You suggested specially segregated toilets for a minority group, my post was to highlight that in less enlightened times this was in place for another demonised minority.
Again, this isn't about you. | | | |
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