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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... 10:07 - Aug 28 with 2999 viewsMarshalls_Mullet

...pipe down.

Hes the democratically elected leader of our country......


....ah, actually, let me come back to you....
[Post edited 28 Aug 2019 10:08]

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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:13 - Aug 28 with 2239 viewsWacko

As much as I think he's a total nob, our parliamentary system doesn't give two hoots as to who the leader of a party is. So no leader is ever democratically elected... Maybe it's time to abolish the monarchy and get a president

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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:20 - Aug 28 with 2218 viewsGuthrum

Technically he is, as the leader of the grouping which can command a majority in the Commons. People voted for the MPs which constitute the parties within that grouping (in the modern era, with explicit knowlege that they belonged to those factions).

If we don't like it, we ought to all pressure our MPs to propose and vote for a motion of No Confidence, then get rid of those who have done this in the subsequent General Election.

That's the danger of something like this prorogation, it robs us (via our representatives) of the ability to change a government who is doing something we disagree with.

Good Lord! Whatever is it?
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:22 - Aug 28 with 2201 viewsMarshalls_Mullet

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:20 - Aug 28 by Guthrum

Technically he is, as the leader of the grouping which can command a majority in the Commons. People voted for the MPs which constitute the parties within that grouping (in the modern era, with explicit knowlege that they belonged to those factions).

If we don't like it, we ought to all pressure our MPs to propose and vote for a motion of No Confidence, then get rid of those who have done this in the subsequent General Election.

That's the danger of something like this prorogation, it robs us (via our representatives) of the ability to change a government who is doing something we disagree with.


"Technically he is, as the leader of the grouping which can command a majority in the Commons..."

I know, I know, I KNOW.

But I suspect you take my point.

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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:35 - Aug 28 with 2163 viewsGlasgowBlue

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:20 - Aug 28 by Guthrum

Technically he is, as the leader of the grouping which can command a majority in the Commons. People voted for the MPs which constitute the parties within that grouping (in the modern era, with explicit knowlege that they belonged to those factions).

If we don't like it, we ought to all pressure our MPs to propose and vote for a motion of No Confidence, then get rid of those who have done this in the subsequent General Election.

That's the danger of something like this prorogation, it robs us (via our representatives) of the ability to change a government who is doing something we disagree with.


The last time a government lost a motion of No Confidence, Jim Callaghan suspended parliament for six weeks in order to fight a general election.

Isn't that exactly what Boris wants?

“A man must be excessively stupid, as well as uncharitable, who believes that there is no virtue but on his own side, and that there are not men as honest as himself who may differ from him in political principles”.
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:40 - Aug 28 with 2128 viewsBABLUE

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:35 - Aug 28 by GlasgowBlue

The last time a government lost a motion of No Confidence, Jim Callaghan suspended parliament for six weeks in order to fight a general election.

Isn't that exactly what Boris wants?


But the anti no deal alliance would command a majority and would win a vote meaning that the leader (presumably JC) would become PM and could delay brexit again before calling a General Election.

That way Brexit is delayed again and there is then a GE.

That is very different from Johnson suspending parliament to force through a no deal Brexit.
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:41 - Aug 28 with 2125 viewsMugwump

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:22 - Aug 28 by Marshalls_Mullet

"Technically he is, as the leader of the grouping which can command a majority in the Commons..."

I know, I know, I KNOW.

But I suspect you take my point.


I don’t take your point, but I may not be the brightest spark.
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:41 - Aug 28 with 2125 viewsBluedandy

Boris Johnson is the ninth prime minister to take office without a general election since 1940.

We elect MPs not PMs.... don't recall any meltdown when Brown ejected Blair from Downing Street with no mandate from the people.

Now there's a surprise.
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:41 - Aug 28 with 2118 viewsSwansea_Blue

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:22 - Aug 28 by Marshalls_Mullet

"Technically he is, as the leader of the grouping which can command a majority in the Commons..."

I know, I know, I KNOW.

But I suspect you take my point.


Well it made me chuckle. A bit of poetic licence comic effect is perfectly acceptable.

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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:43 - Aug 28 with 2097 viewsMugwump

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:41 - Aug 28 by Bluedandy

Boris Johnson is the ninth prime minister to take office without a general election since 1940.

We elect MPs not PMs.... don't recall any meltdown when Brown ejected Blair from Downing Street with no mandate from the people.

Now there's a surprise.


Oh that’s what he means.

You an add Nicola Sturgeon to that.
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:43 - Aug 28 with 2099 viewsGuthrum

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:35 - Aug 28 by GlasgowBlue

The last time a government lost a motion of No Confidence, Jim Callaghan suspended parliament for six weeks in order to fight a general election.

Isn't that exactly what Boris wants?


Would Johnson be prepared to sacrifice his government, his party and his own reputation/legacy in a suicidal bid to get No Deal through at all costs?

The EU has already stated that a pending GE would be good enough reason to further postpone the leaving date. Even if the government did try to bind the hands of its successor by not asking for that, such a course would be open to legal challenge.

Good Lord! Whatever is it?
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:45 - Aug 28 with 2085 viewsGlasgowBlue

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:40 - Aug 28 by BABLUE

But the anti no deal alliance would command a majority and would win a vote meaning that the leader (presumably JC) would become PM and could delay brexit again before calling a General Election.

That way Brexit is delayed again and there is then a GE.

That is very different from Johnson suspending parliament to force through a no deal Brexit.


The anti no deal alliance are made up of remainers and soft brexiters. They don't speak with one voice and can't decide who should be PM if Boris falls. Whereas the government seems pretty ruthless, scheming and determined.

“A man must be excessively stupid, as well as uncharitable, who believes that there is no virtue but on his own side, and that there are not men as honest as himself who may differ from him in political principles”.
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:46 - Aug 28 with 2079 viewsElmswell_Blue

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:41 - Aug 28 by Bluedandy

Boris Johnson is the ninth prime minister to take office without a general election since 1940.

We elect MPs not PMs.... don't recall any meltdown when Brown ejected Blair from Downing Street with no mandate from the people.

Now there's a surprise.


Boris Johnson went into complete meltdown about how Brown was "unelected" in 2007 and demanded a general election forthwith as he claimed that his becoming PM was "undemocratic."

I fail to find any subject where it is possible to defend / support Johnson over what he says.
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:48 - Aug 28 with 2072 viewsMeadowlark

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:41 - Aug 28 by Bluedandy

Boris Johnson is the ninth prime minister to take office without a general election since 1940.

We elect MPs not PMs.... don't recall any meltdown when Brown ejected Blair from Downing Street with no mandate from the people.

Now there's a surprise.


Your memory is probably not too good. We all have days like that.

Boris (Hypocrite) Johnson led the meltdown.

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2019/06/without-mandate-british-people-
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:53 - Aug 28 with 2042 viewsBloomBlue

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:35 - Aug 28 by GlasgowBlue

The last time a government lost a motion of No Confidence, Jim Callaghan suspended parliament for six weeks in order to fight a general election.

Isn't that exactly what Boris wants?


Paraliament is suspended every year around this time for the party conference season I've not heard any party demand the party conference season should be cancelled leading at to today's news and now those same people are calling the suspending outrages
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... (n/t) on 10:55 - Aug 28 with 2029 viewsElmswell_Blue

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:46 - Aug 28 by Elmswell_Blue

Boris Johnson went into complete meltdown about how Brown was "unelected" in 2007 and demanded a general election forthwith as he claimed that his becoming PM was "undemocratic."

I fail to find any subject where it is possible to defend / support Johnson over what he says.


[Post edited 28 Aug 2019 10:56]
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:58 - Aug 28 with 2017 viewsElmswell_Blue

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:48 - Aug 28 by Meadowlark

Your memory is probably not too good. We all have days like that.

Boris (Hypocrite) Johnson led the meltdown.

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2019/06/without-mandate-british-people-


You beat me to it! I was looking for that article too. It's a shame the media don't bring it back out, similarly Johnson's documentary where he said Turkish accession to the EU would be "a marvelous thing."
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:58 - Aug 28 with 2011 viewsBluedandy

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:46 - Aug 28 by Elmswell_Blue

Boris Johnson went into complete meltdown about how Brown was "unelected" in 2007 and demanded a general election forthwith as he claimed that his becoming PM was "undemocratic."

I fail to find any subject where it is possible to defend / support Johnson over what he says.


Of course he did... that's called politics...but he did not have a constitutional leg to stand on.

Johnson's biggest political hero Churchill was unelected in 1940 - do you think that bothers him?

You just can't stand Johnson... it has got nothing to do with democracy...
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... (n/t) on 10:59 - Aug 28 with 2006 viewsElmswell_Blue

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... (n/t) on 10:55 - Aug 28 by Elmswell_Blue

[Post edited 28 Aug 2019 10:56]


No I can't stand Johnson. I don't have the rest of the day to list my reasons. If you think he is a true democrat who has real conviction then you are lost.
[Post edited 28 Aug 2019 11:00]
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 12:07 - Aug 28 with 1873 viewsmeekreech

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:20 - Aug 28 by Guthrum

Technically he is, as the leader of the grouping which can command a majority in the Commons. People voted for the MPs which constitute the parties within that grouping (in the modern era, with explicit knowlege that they belonged to those factions).

If we don't like it, we ought to all pressure our MPs to propose and vote for a motion of No Confidence, then get rid of those who have done this in the subsequent General Election.

That's the danger of something like this prorogation, it robs us (via our representatives) of the ability to change a government who is doing something we disagree with.


You may not have voted to leave the eu but the majority of the electorate did! The majority of mps voted for article 52 where the default position in the law of the land is to leave on the 31st October whether with or without a satisfactory agreement!

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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 12:25 - Aug 28 with 1820 viewsGuthrum

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 12:07 - Aug 28 by meekreech

You may not have voted to leave the eu but the majority of the electorate did! The majority of mps voted for article 52 where the default position in the law of the land is to leave on the 31st October whether with or without a satisfactory agreement!


Actually, it was to leave on March the 29th. That got moved, then moved again (at the instigation of the government). Having set such a precedent, it can be moved a third time - if the EU agree.

Parliament voted to trigger Article 50 in the face of an obdurate refusal by the EU to conduct substantive negotiations until that had occurred. Thus the specific date has only come about due to us caving in to external pressure.

A fairly narrow majority of the electorate voted in June 2016 in favour of leaving the EU. There was no mention of leaving without a deal during the campaign, nor has any opinion poll suggested a nationwide majority in favour of doing so.

Good Lord! Whatever is it?
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 12:27 - Aug 28 with 1805 viewsFelstow1978

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:45 - Aug 28 by GlasgowBlue

The anti no deal alliance are made up of remainers and soft brexiters. They don't speak with one voice and can't decide who should be PM if Boris falls. Whereas the government seems pretty ruthless, scheming and determined.


BORIS JOHNSON WILL DIE FOR THIS

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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 12:29 - Aug 28 with 1794 viewsTangledupin_Blue

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 10:41 - Aug 28 by Bluedandy

Boris Johnson is the ninth prime minister to take office without a general election since 1940.

We elect MPs not PMs.... don't recall any meltdown when Brown ejected Blair from Downing Street with no mandate from the people.

Now there's a surprise.


Perhaps your recall isn't serving you well. There was plenty of outcry when Brown became PM. Oddly enough, a good deal of it from some who are now in Johnson's cabinet.

Here is one of several quotes by Johnson himself from when Brown became PM:
"It's the arrogance. It's the contempt. That's what gets me. It's Gordon Brown's apparent belief that he can just trample on the will of the British people."

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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 12:35 - Aug 28 with 1776 viewsGuthrum

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 12:27 - Aug 28 by Felstow1978

BORIS JOHNSON WILL DIE FOR THIS


That's not a good or helpful thing to say, even in jest.

Good Lord! Whatever is it?
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 13:15 - Aug 28 with 1677 viewsmrshallisfit

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 12:35 - Aug 28 by Guthrum

That's not a good or helpful thing to say, even in jest.


And especially in CAPS.
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To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 13:20 - Aug 28 with 1666 viewsfactual_blue

To all those talking about Boris etc being anti democratic... on 12:25 - Aug 28 by Guthrum

Actually, it was to leave on March the 29th. That got moved, then moved again (at the instigation of the government). Having set such a precedent, it can be moved a third time - if the EU agree.

Parliament voted to trigger Article 50 in the face of an obdurate refusal by the EU to conduct substantive negotiations until that had occurred. Thus the specific date has only come about due to us caving in to external pressure.

A fairly narrow majority of the electorate voted in June 2016 in favour of leaving the EU. There was no mention of leaving without a deal during the campaign, nor has any opinion poll suggested a nationwide majority in favour of doing so.


Good luck with speaking truth unto stupidity Guthers.

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