| Why no one wants ITFC 04:36 - Jan 8 with 3428 views | chrismakin |
Can't sleep, so thinking about town whilst playing FM2020 and see a few times potential interest in buying the club comes up but nothing happens.
Apparently in real life, Evans has said a few people have asked about the club
Just imagining they aren't great offers. WHY wouldn't a incredibly wealthy ( and actually wealthy not Evans type wealthy) want to buy town and plough their money in
Owns the training centre
Could pretty much rebuild PR as much as you like as Council wouldn't really say no to much, plus we have the old training pitch etc etc
Only an hour away from London, very marketable
Still a very well known football club throughout the World
lots of history
History of bringing through youngsters
Very passionate support base
When you see clubs like Newcastle, the leicesters etc get bought, what has stopped town following suit, you reckon its Evans making it hard work? or just no genuine interest |  |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 08:18 - Jan 8 with 2927 views | Metal_Hacker |
I still think a lot of it boils down to catchment area . Population of Leicester approx 350k , Newcastle 270k - Ipswich 133k
Not saying that's the main issue but I'm pretty sure any potential buyer worth their salt would look at the demographics of how they would recoup and use their asset
As for "only an hour from London" - so many clubs in London far more attractive than ours to support.
Don't get me wrong I'd love nothing more than someone to come along and prove me wrong by investing BUT....I seriously do believe this to be a critical issue |  |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:33 - Jan 8 with 2820 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 08:18 - Jan 8 by Metal_Hacker |
I still think a lot of it boils down to catchment area . Population of Leicester approx 350k , Newcastle 270k - Ipswich 133k
Not saying that's the main issue but I'm pretty sure any potential buyer worth their salt would look at the demographics of how they would recoup and use their asset
As for "only an hour from London" - so many clubs in London far more attractive than ours to support.
Don't get me wrong I'd love nothing more than someone to come along and prove me wrong by investing BUT....I seriously do believe this to be a critical issue |
Bigger catchment than Leicester though with no close competition. Leicester have got Debry, Nottingham, all the Birmingham clubs, Coventry, and possibly even Stoke all closer than Norwich is to us.
We should be eminently marketable, especially in this league. Sunderland moreso, but then we're next in terms of a club that would take the least work to get ready for the PL, if that was the serious name. And then in the PL we'd be mid table in terms of attendances and about 5K more than Leicester (assuming we sold out, as we did last time). We're 'bigger' than quite a few clubs who've had decent runs in the PL lately (Burnley, Swansea, Leicester until they got the new training ground, Bournmouth, Palace, Watford?, etc).
There have been a few things said about former interest that make me think ME would be looking for a significant return on his 'investment', so I wouldn't be surprised if a potentially too high asking price has/is putting people off. That's only picked up from the odd phrase here or there though, so I could be wrong.
My worry is that he'd be as good at selling the club as he has been at overseeing the last 13+ years. Which means we'll either put off buyers or he'll sell to a nutcase. |  |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:42 - Jan 8 with 2784 views | Metal_Hacker |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:33 - Jan 8 by Swansea_Blue |
Bigger catchment than Leicester though with no close competition. Leicester have got Debry, Nottingham, all the Birmingham clubs, Coventry, and possibly even Stoke all closer than Norwich is to us.
We should be eminently marketable, especially in this league. Sunderland moreso, but then we're next in terms of a club that would take the least work to get ready for the PL, if that was the serious name. And then in the PL we'd be mid table in terms of attendances and about 5K more than Leicester (assuming we sold out, as we did last time). We're 'bigger' than quite a few clubs who've had decent runs in the PL lately (Burnley, Swansea, Leicester until they got the new training ground, Bournmouth, Palace, Watford?, etc).
There have been a few things said about former interest that make me think ME would be looking for a significant return on his 'investment', so I wouldn't be surprised if a potentially too high asking price has/is putting people off. That's only picked up from the odd phrase here or there though, so I could be wrong.
My worry is that he'd be as good at selling the club as he has been at overseeing the last 13+ years. Which means we'll either put off buyers or he'll sell to a nutcase. |
I guess it's all relative to a degree as well though ref population
East Mids population if we're talking solely Leicester is nearly 5 million ,again with a good number of clubs splattered around I admit
Population of Suffolk 760 k | |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:42 - Jan 8 with 2789 views | SomethingBlue |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 08:18 - Jan 8 by Metal_Hacker |
I still think a lot of it boils down to catchment area . Population of Leicester approx 350k , Newcastle 270k - Ipswich 133k
Not saying that's the main issue but I'm pretty sure any potential buyer worth their salt would look at the demographics of how they would recoup and use their asset
As for "only an hour from London" - so many clubs in London far more attractive than ours to support.
Don't get me wrong I'd love nothing more than someone to come along and prove me wrong by investing BUT....I seriously do believe this to be a critical issue |
There are 760,000 people in Suffolk though (more than in Leicestershire) and *far* fewer professional clubs in spitting distance. That's before we account for those pockets of north Essex etc.
ITFC has its limitations, obviously, but it undersells itself chronically. The self-loathing and low ambition drive me nuts. A group with some vision would absolutely transform the place. |  |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:43 - Jan 8 with 2780 views | jayessess |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:33 - Jan 8 by Swansea_Blue |
Bigger catchment than Leicester though with no close competition. Leicester have got Debry, Nottingham, all the Birmingham clubs, Coventry, and possibly even Stoke all closer than Norwich is to us.
We should be eminently marketable, especially in this league. Sunderland moreso, but then we're next in terms of a club that would take the least work to get ready for the PL, if that was the serious name. And then in the PL we'd be mid table in terms of attendances and about 5K more than Leicester (assuming we sold out, as we did last time). We're 'bigger' than quite a few clubs who've had decent runs in the PL lately (Burnley, Swansea, Leicester until they got the new training ground, Bournmouth, Palace, Watford?, etc).
There have been a few things said about former interest that make me think ME would be looking for a significant return on his 'investment', so I wouldn't be surprised if a potentially too high asking price has/is putting people off. That's only picked up from the odd phrase here or there though, so I could be wrong.
My worry is that he'd be as good at selling the club as he has been at overseeing the last 13+ years. Which means we'll either put off buyers or he'll sell to a nutcase. |
The mystery is really why anyone would want to buy any football club, really. Most of them aren't profitable and the ones that are (Liverpool, Man U) tend to get bought up by debt-leveraged US sports conglomerates rather than generous benefactors.
There's no conceivable profit to be made from Ipswich Town, even if we made it to the Premier League. [Post edited 8 Jan 2021 10:03]
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:48 - Jan 8 with 2761 views | Steve_M |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:43 - Jan 8 by jayessess |
The mystery is really why anyone would want to buy any football club, really. Most of them aren't profitable and the ones that are (Liverpool, Man U) tend to get bought up by debt-leveraged US sports conglomerates rather than generous benefactors.
There's no conceivable profit to be made from Ipswich Town, even if we made it to the Premier League. [Post edited 8 Jan 2021 10:03]
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Deals where the new owners take the upside and the club the downside perhaps:
Not got a subscription so not read beyond the Tweet here. |  |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:49 - Jan 8 with 2756 views | Metal_Hacker |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:42 - Jan 8 by SomethingBlue |
There are 760,000 people in Suffolk though (more than in Leicestershire) and *far* fewer professional clubs in spitting distance. That's before we account for those pockets of north Essex etc.
ITFC has its limitations, obviously, but it undersells itself chronically. The self-loathing and low ambition drive me nuts. A group with some vision would absolutely transform the place. |
The numbers are comparable with Leicestershire to be fair but I get your point . The only thing I would say is there would be a massive difference in terms of condensed population in other parts of the country compared to Suffolk and dare I mention Norfolk.There are a lot of fields between places
Anyway....let's just hope someone does get tempted and we become the new Leicester , never thought I'd be saying that after being a fan of 40+ years - " the new Leicester" | |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:54 - Jan 8 with 2745 views | itfcjoe |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:42 - Jan 8 by SomethingBlue |
There are 760,000 people in Suffolk though (more than in Leicestershire) and *far* fewer professional clubs in spitting distance. That's before we account for those pockets of north Essex etc.
ITFC has its limitations, obviously, but it undersells itself chronically. The self-loathing and low ambition drive me nuts. A group with some vision would absolutely transform the place. |
Sadly, Evans doesn't want to sell to anyone, or invest in the right areas to progress |  |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:59 - Jan 8 with 2731 views | SomethingBlue |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:49 - Jan 8 by Metal_Hacker |
The numbers are comparable with Leicestershire to be fair but I get your point . The only thing I would say is there would be a massive difference in terms of condensed population in other parts of the country compared to Suffolk and dare I mention Norfolk.There are a lot of fields between places
Anyway....let's just hope someone does get tempted and we become the new Leicester , never thought I'd be saying that after being a fan of 40+ years - " the new Leicester" |
I see the south coast clubs (Brighton/Saints) as a closer analogue of what ITFC could be/should have been, really. Still possible if the club is in the right hands. | |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:04 - Jan 8 with 2701 views | Metal_Hacker |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:59 - Jan 8 by SomethingBlue |
I see the south coast clubs (Brighton/Saints) as a closer analogue of what ITFC could be/should have been, really. Still possible if the club is in the right hands. |
Yeah perhaps a better example
Well here's hoping . Perhaps one day before I'm 6ft under | |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:06 - Jan 8 with 2696 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:43 - Jan 8 by jayessess |
The mystery is really why anyone would want to buy any football club, really. Most of them aren't profitable and the ones that are (Liverpool, Man U) tend to get bought up by debt-leveraged US sports conglomerates rather than generous benefactors.
There's no conceivable profit to be made from Ipswich Town, even if we made it to the Premier League. [Post edited 8 Jan 2021 10:03]
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Yeas, that's the top level question. Why on earth would you do this. You can turn a profit in the PL, but as a small club it puts you at a disadvantage. But then you'd have lost money hand over fist in the Championship trying to get promoted and competing against the clubs with parachute payments. | |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:06 - Jan 8 with 2694 views | clive_baker |
I think the questions is my why would anyone want to? To be on the hook for the inevitable operating loses which run into the millions per year. Its quite an expensive play thing, especially for anyone with no emotional attachment to the club. Would you do that for a Sunderland or Preston? The net book value of the assets is tiny relative to the consideration ME would be looking for, so on paper it's hard to make a case in that respect. All anyone would be paying for is some goodwill (heritage, industry, status etc), the short potential to sell a few kids at some profit which would be lucky to cover any operating loses, and the longer term potential of lucking out and somehow getting promotion to the Premier League, which feels increasingly unlikely without very deep pockets, and even then it's far from guaranteed.
I would imagine ME is either asking too much, doesn't really want out, or there's just a very small pool of suitors for a L1 football club. Or a combination of those. We need to hope a passionate Ipswich supporter becomes obscenely wealthy and fancies wasting some of it buying the club. |  |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:06 - Jan 8 with 2696 views | FrankfurtBlue |
Without any specific inside knowledge, I deduce the following:
ME bought ITFC in 2007 as a pure "investor", thinking he could invest ca. £20m to achieve a quick £35m+ return, after securing promotion to the EPL.
After a few seasons of throwing money down the drain, the then faceless investor reduced his spending to a minimum after realising that promotion was not easily attainable. At that point, he did not officially put the club up for sale, but sought out potential buyers, thinking he could still recover a substantial part of his "investment".
It became very clear to any interested parties that ME wanted too much for a club that had gone from promotion aspirants to Championship survivalists. Investment banking advisors/equity consultants became disinterested. ME had effectively priced himself out of the market and was not considered a serious seller.
Having cut costs to the bone, but still wasting money with poor decisions and a lack of expertise (e.g. letting saleable players run their contracts down), the debt to ME grew season after season, but the on-pitch performances worsened. Under pressure from dwindling attendances and anti-support, ME oversaw a series of catastrophic decisions that saw ITFC relegated from the Championship.
Presumably, ME has been advised that he can expect next to nothing, if he was to sell the club in the third tier (two promotions away from the promised land). ME is hoping for a quick return to the Championship. The problem of ME and his continued aspirations for a higher return than is warranted by the club's present position. In other words, any potential buyers will find out that the price is still too high, as has always been the case under ME.
I do not believe that there has been a lack of investor interest in ITFC over the years, as ME would have you believe, but he has effectively killed any interest with unrealistic pricing.
Would love to know the truth of the matter though. |  | | |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:10 - Jan 8 with 2680 views | longtimefan |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:33 - Jan 8 by Swansea_Blue |
Bigger catchment than Leicester though with no close competition. Leicester have got Debry, Nottingham, all the Birmingham clubs, Coventry, and possibly even Stoke all closer than Norwich is to us.
We should be eminently marketable, especially in this league. Sunderland moreso, but then we're next in terms of a club that would take the least work to get ready for the PL, if that was the serious name. And then in the PL we'd be mid table in terms of attendances and about 5K more than Leicester (assuming we sold out, as we did last time). We're 'bigger' than quite a few clubs who've had decent runs in the PL lately (Burnley, Swansea, Leicester until they got the new training ground, Bournmouth, Palace, Watford?, etc).
There have been a few things said about former interest that make me think ME would be looking for a significant return on his 'investment', so I wouldn't be surprised if a potentially too high asking price has/is putting people off. That's only picked up from the odd phrase here or there though, so I could be wrong.
My worry is that he'd be as good at selling the club as he has been at overseeing the last 13+ years. Which means we'll either put off buyers or he'll sell to a nutcase. |
“ And then in the PL we'd be mid table in terms of attendances and about 5K more than Leicester (assuming we sold out, as we did last time). ”
Leicester’s average PL attendance for non Covid affected seasons is larger than our 30K capacity, so I’m not sure what you’re basing that 5K figure on? | | | |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:22 - Jan 8 with 2661 views | jayessess |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:06 - Jan 8 by Swansea_Blue |
Yeas, that's the top level question. Why on earth would you do this. You can turn a profit in the PL, but as a small club it puts you at a disadvantage. But then you'd have lost money hand over fist in the Championship trying to get promoted and competing against the clubs with parachute payments. |
Potential profits tend to get eaten up by trying to be competitive. Last full PL accounts (2018-19) had Brighton, Leicester, West Ham, Bournemouth, Southampton all making a substantial losses, Watford made a profit and were relegated not long after.
On top of that Norwich, Sheffield United and Aston Villa made huge losses getting promoted that year. Sheffield United's loss (not their budget, just their losses!) were bigger than our total budget that year. Norwich's loss was twice our budget! Aston Villa's loss was three times our total budget!
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:36 - Jan 8 with 2629 views | Fartman |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 09:42 - Jan 8 by Metal_Hacker |
I guess it's all relative to a degree as well though ref population
East Mids population if we're talking solely Leicester is nearly 5 million ,again with a good number of clubs splattered around I admit
Population of Suffolk 760 k |
Add parts of Essex and Cambridgeshire to the party, then I'll guess we're above 1 mill. |  |
| "Success is not final; failure is not fatal: It is the courage to continue that counts."
-- Winston S. Churchill |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:37 - Jan 8 with 2629 views | longtimefan |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:06 - Jan 8 by FrankfurtBlue |
Without any specific inside knowledge, I deduce the following:
ME bought ITFC in 2007 as a pure "investor", thinking he could invest ca. £20m to achieve a quick £35m+ return, after securing promotion to the EPL.
After a few seasons of throwing money down the drain, the then faceless investor reduced his spending to a minimum after realising that promotion was not easily attainable. At that point, he did not officially put the club up for sale, but sought out potential buyers, thinking he could still recover a substantial part of his "investment".
It became very clear to any interested parties that ME wanted too much for a club that had gone from promotion aspirants to Championship survivalists. Investment banking advisors/equity consultants became disinterested. ME had effectively priced himself out of the market and was not considered a serious seller.
Having cut costs to the bone, but still wasting money with poor decisions and a lack of expertise (e.g. letting saleable players run their contracts down), the debt to ME grew season after season, but the on-pitch performances worsened. Under pressure from dwindling attendances and anti-support, ME oversaw a series of catastrophic decisions that saw ITFC relegated from the Championship.
Presumably, ME has been advised that he can expect next to nothing, if he was to sell the club in the third tier (two promotions away from the promised land). ME is hoping for a quick return to the Championship. The problem of ME and his continued aspirations for a higher return than is warranted by the club's present position. In other words, any potential buyers will find out that the price is still too high, as has always been the case under ME.
I do not believe that there has been a lack of investor interest in ITFC over the years, as ME would have you believe, but he has effectively killed any interest with unrealistic pricing.
Would love to know the truth of the matter though. |
Given Sheepshanks struggled to find any investors interested in us while we were in the upper reaches of the Championship, before finally persuading Evans, I suspect the pool of people willing to plough money into a L1 team might be much smaller than you seem to think. | | | |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:50 - Jan 8 with 2594 views | FrankfurtBlue |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:37 - Jan 8 by longtimefan |
Given Sheepshanks struggled to find any investors interested in us while we were in the upper reaches of the Championship, before finally persuading Evans, I suspect the pool of people willing to plough money into a L1 team might be much smaller than you seem to think. |
I wouldn't think for one moment that they will be queuing up for a L1 Ipswich. Indeed, my main point was that ME's price expectations probably scared off any serious interest years ago. | | | |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 12:06 - Jan 8 with 2525 views | jayessess |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 10:06 - Jan 8 by FrankfurtBlue |
Without any specific inside knowledge, I deduce the following:
ME bought ITFC in 2007 as a pure "investor", thinking he could invest ca. £20m to achieve a quick £35m+ return, after securing promotion to the EPL.
After a few seasons of throwing money down the drain, the then faceless investor reduced his spending to a minimum after realising that promotion was not easily attainable. At that point, he did not officially put the club up for sale, but sought out potential buyers, thinking he could still recover a substantial part of his "investment".
It became very clear to any interested parties that ME wanted too much for a club that had gone from promotion aspirants to Championship survivalists. Investment banking advisors/equity consultants became disinterested. ME had effectively priced himself out of the market and was not considered a serious seller.
Having cut costs to the bone, but still wasting money with poor decisions and a lack of expertise (e.g. letting saleable players run their contracts down), the debt to ME grew season after season, but the on-pitch performances worsened. Under pressure from dwindling attendances and anti-support, ME oversaw a series of catastrophic decisions that saw ITFC relegated from the Championship.
Presumably, ME has been advised that he can expect next to nothing, if he was to sell the club in the third tier (two promotions away from the promised land). ME is hoping for a quick return to the Championship. The problem of ME and his continued aspirations for a higher return than is warranted by the club's present position. In other words, any potential buyers will find out that the price is still too high, as has always been the case under ME.
I do not believe that there has been a lack of investor interest in ITFC over the years, as ME would have you believe, but he has effectively killed any interest with unrealistic pricing.
Would love to know the truth of the matter though. |
If Evans were a "pure investor" he'd be long gone at this point, really. There hasn't been a serious prospect of him even recouping his losses for many years and he'd have been better off cutting us loose at any point and accepting whatever was offered.
His behaviour in League One also doesn't fit the profile of someone who wants a quick promotion and quick sale. The insistence on a playing style, the 5-year contract to Lambert, the funding of the academy. None of them make any sense if he doesn't in some (ludicrous, wrong-headed) way see himself as the long term steward of the club.
I think the only rational way you can understand Evans' behaviour is that he does genuinely want to own the club and for the club to succeed. That doesn't work out because he's not competent, not because he wants us to fail. | |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 12:08 - Jan 8 with 2518 views | itfcjoe |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 12:06 - Jan 8 by jayessess |
If Evans were a "pure investor" he'd be long gone at this point, really. There hasn't been a serious prospect of him even recouping his losses for many years and he'd have been better off cutting us loose at any point and accepting whatever was offered.
His behaviour in League One also doesn't fit the profile of someone who wants a quick promotion and quick sale. The insistence on a playing style, the 5-year contract to Lambert, the funding of the academy. None of them make any sense if he doesn't in some (ludicrous, wrong-headed) way see himself as the long term steward of the club.
I think the only rational way you can understand Evans' behaviour is that he does genuinely want to own the club and for the club to succeed. That doesn't work out because he's not competent, not because he wants us to fail. |
I think you are spot on there. | |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 12:17 - Jan 8 with 2507 views | Metal_Hacker |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 12:06 - Jan 8 by jayessess |
If Evans were a "pure investor" he'd be long gone at this point, really. There hasn't been a serious prospect of him even recouping his losses for many years and he'd have been better off cutting us loose at any point and accepting whatever was offered.
His behaviour in League One also doesn't fit the profile of someone who wants a quick promotion and quick sale. The insistence on a playing style, the 5-year contract to Lambert, the funding of the academy. None of them make any sense if he doesn't in some (ludicrous, wrong-headed) way see himself as the long term steward of the club.
I think the only rational way you can understand Evans' behaviour is that he does genuinely want to own the club and for the club to succeed. That doesn't work out because he's not competent, not because he wants us to fail. |
It's crazy how he can be as successful as he has been as a business man BUT the running of a football club (no offence to any out there ) he comes across as a market stall trader
Surely a business is a business ....or perhaps that's where we're going wrong . It's being ran as a business as opposed to a football club | |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 12:31 - Jan 8 with 2483 views | jayessess |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 12:17 - Jan 8 by Metal_Hacker |
It's crazy how he can be as successful as he has been as a business man BUT the running of a football club (no offence to any out there ) he comes across as a market stall trader
Surely a business is a business ....or perhaps that's where we're going wrong . It's being ran as a business as opposed to a football club |
Football clubs make for ludicrous businesses.
- They're forced to maximise expenditure to succeed
- They prioritise product quality over profits
- The entire community lays down a moral claim to them
- Many of your customers will keep coming even when totally dissatisfied with the product
- Success is dependent on a mind-spinning array of intangible variables
I suspect beyond basic accountancy, HR management, marketing and PR, there's very little in running a regular profit-driven business that's applicable to running a football club. | |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 13:00 - Jan 8 with 2453 views | Keno |
A few years ago I spoke to a client who worked closely with a Arab Royal family (minor one I hate to add)
I joked about them buying Ipswich to which the reply was 'we have actually looked at it but there isnt enough money in it to get much of a return' |  |
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| Why no one wants ITFC on 13:47 - Jan 8 with 2399 views | longtimefan |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 12:31 - Jan 8 by jayessess |
Football clubs make for ludicrous businesses.
- They're forced to maximise expenditure to succeed
- They prioritise product quality over profits
- The entire community lays down a moral claim to them
- Many of your customers will keep coming even when totally dissatisfied with the product
- Success is dependent on a mind-spinning array of intangible variables
I suspect beyond basic accountancy, HR management, marketing and PR, there's very little in running a regular profit-driven business that's applicable to running a football club. |
I suspect much of Evan’s lack of success with ITFC is precisely because he’s tried to run it more like a traditional business. | | | |
| Why no one wants ITFC on 15:58 - Jan 8 with 2333 views | thebooks |
I guess the only reason to buy a football club is to launder money/reputation or leverage vast debt to turn a regular profit. Or some sort of gambling racket. I guess there are clubs ahead of us now. |  | | |
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