| 5 wins out of 7 now.... 08:30 - Feb 7 with 7070 views | itfcjoe |
....and still an absolute country mile away from the play offs.
So frustrating just how far off it we were left to get, we are going to need something like 11 wins in our last 16 games with a couple of draws just to have a coin flip chance of making the top 6.
Must win tomorrow, must play better than Saturday.... |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:40 - Feb 7 with 1675 views | unstableblue |
On the plus side.. a few teams will drop away and that could be Wycombe and Sunderland, the latter big time, despite the spending
On the negative side I can only see Sheff Weds getting better, far more effective than us at Hillsborough despite our posession. I can see MK Dons and Oxford being VERY hard to beatin those crucial games. And most importantly whether its considering this speculative play off push OR next seasons crucial campaign in League One, the squad is showing all the hallmarks of why we are here in the first place, and the team is going backwards from a system and player performance perspective.
But as you say Joe - a good win tomorrow, a performance, and a win at MK and we'll be in a different place. Also on Tuesday
MK are away at Fleetwood
Oxford away at Accrington
Sunderland away at Cheltehnham
Weds home to Wigan
Then Saturday:
Sunderland away at Wimbledon
Wycombe away at Lincoln
Oxford home to Bolton
MK Dons host us and 7000 blues
There WILL be points dropped and ground gained if we can sort out our performances!! and its a big IF |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:46 - Feb 7 with 1656 views | Darth_Koont |
Steady improvement is the key to us getting to the playoffs and also realising the bigger-picture ambition of promotion to the Prem League (and consolidation) over the next half-dozen years.
One improvement is that we are getting points without playing well. But it shows the extent of what we still need to do to get into the play-offs and then through them.
Also good that our expectations have got a little more sober after the silliness of Gillingham away.
Trust McKenna and the process. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:46 - Feb 7 with 1667 views | blueasfook |
Problem is the top 6 have been winning also. We are 6th in the recent form table (last 6 results) - with most of the current top 6 above us in that table.
Also got to watch Bolton who have been winning too.
https://thefishy.co.uk/formtable.php?table=3 |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:53 - Feb 7 with 1637 views | GlasgowBlue |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:46 - Feb 7 by blueasfook |
Problem is the top 6 have been winning also. We are 6th in the recent form table (last 6 results) - with most of the current top 6 above us in that table.
Also got to watch Bolton who have been winning too.
https://thefishy.co.uk/formtable.php?table=3 |
The Top 10 if current form continues by GlasgowBlue 5 Feb 2022 19:45Looking at the form over the past six games for the runners and the riders.
Rotherham 2.5 points per game
MK Dons 2.5 points per game
Wigan 2.33 points per game
Bolton 2.17 Points per game
Shef Wed 2 Points per game
Ipswich 2 points per game
Oxford 1.66 points per game
Wycombe 1.66 points per game
Plymouth 1.66 points per game
Sunderland .66 points per game
If the top 10 maintain this form then the Top 6 will be:
1. Rotherham 105
2. Wigan 103
3. MK Dons 95
4. Shef Wed 83
5. Wycombe 80
6. Plymouth 79
7. Oxford 77
8. Ipswich 76
9. Bolton 76
10. Sunderland 65
Not a perfect science by any means. Teams will drop in form. Many of the top ten will have to play each other. But it's a good indication for those who are writing off the season that one extra win and we can make the top six.
In the words of Peter Gabriel; Don't Give Up.
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:57 - Feb 7 with 1619 views | blueasfook |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:53 - Feb 7 by GlasgowBlue |
The Top 10 if current form continues by GlasgowBlue 5 Feb 2022 19:45Looking at the form over the past six games for the runners and the riders.
Rotherham 2.5 points per game
MK Dons 2.5 points per game
Wigan 2.33 points per game
Bolton 2.17 Points per game
Shef Wed 2 Points per game
Ipswich 2 points per game
Oxford 1.66 points per game
Wycombe 1.66 points per game
Plymouth 1.66 points per game
Sunderland .66 points per game
If the top 10 maintain this form then the Top 6 will be:
1. Rotherham 105
2. Wigan 103
3. MK Dons 95
4. Shef Wed 83
5. Wycombe 80
6. Plymouth 79
7. Oxford 77
8. Ipswich 76
9. Bolton 76
10. Sunderland 65
Not a perfect science by any means. Teams will drop in form. Many of the top ten will have to play each other. But it's a good indication for those who are writing off the season that one extra win and we can make the top six.
In the words of Peter Gabriel; Don't Give Up.
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I think it will be close but we will just miss out.
That tosser Cook simply left us too much ground to make up. Maybe a good thing so we can have a good run at it next season and go up as champions :) | |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:58 - Feb 7 with 1604 views | clive_baker |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:11 - Feb 7 by Chrisd |
I agree CB. We lack a resilience and can still have that soft underbelly. If we are put under enough pressure we buckle, however you look at a side like Rotherham they stay in games by being resolute and not folding. When I was looking at the league table yesterday I couldn't believe they'd only conceded 5 away goals all season in the league. That is a incredible stat! KM seems to have shored us up defensively more recently, but I always feel if we go behind then invariably we struggle to get back into games, especially if we are playing poorly ala Sheffield Wednesday away. |
Yes, especially under Cook we were so naive and easy to score against. One thing I wanted when he left was someone who valued the art of defending, being robust, clean sheets. McGreal probably helped a little with that and that's really encouraging from KM's start. I know the personnel is different now, and Walton / Edmundson / Morsy make a difference, but we conceded 15 goals in Cook's first 6 games. Just completely unfathomable, wreckless, soft as sh1t. Compared to 4 in Cook's 7 games. There's a lot more we need to do in certain areas of the pitch but we do look more cohesive and consistent defensively.
Re. Sheff Wed it's cliche but I thought we could've been there all day and not scored. Literally, we didn't even get close to looking a threat. I would like to see us playing more football in the final third, getting the ball forward more directly, bypassing midfield more often and more variety in our play. With the 'bash brothers' up front if we can hit them early and the channels, we have so much quality around them in Morsy, Burns, Celina, Chaplin to create. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:58 - Feb 7 with 1608 views | Keno |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:57 - Feb 7 by blueasfook |
I think it will be close but we will just miss out.
That tosser Cook simply left us too much ground to make up. Maybe a good thing so we can have a good run at it next season and go up as champions :) |
Next season we will finally get to board HMS P1ss the League!! |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:58 - Feb 7 with 1601 views | tractorboy1978 |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 10:53 - Feb 7 by clive_baker |
How often are we falling on the wrong side of these supposed fairly even games though? Plymouth away, Sunderland away, Bolton away. All supposedly even, yet 0 points, 1 scored, 6 conceded. At what point is it more than bad luck?
We've defintely tried to be too clever, I really do beleive that and have done for a long time. It's like there's been an arrogance about us that we're at a level we have no right to be at, our fans, our history, on the pitch and off it. I can't think of sides at this level getting anything but admirers by playing out from the back to the extent we have. Crewe are nice to watch, but it's not got them anywhere. It was a big frustration of a number of the camp when Lambert was here, that we overplayed and seemed obsessed by developing this style that just never seemed to penetrate anyone half decent. The over emphasis on possession, largely without purpose, rather than playing to the strenghts of who we had available to us. Meanwhile look at Rotherham, Coventry, Blackpool all with a clear identity, far more pragmatism but hard to play against. Coventry and Blackpool have made the transition to the Championship pretty well too, and I dare say they have less possession of the ball than their opponents more often than not.
I would love us to have invested in developing an approach that was a bit more back to basics, 2 up front, more direct, defenders who can defend, creativity wide and a sh1thouse or 2 up front. McGreal was taking us a step towards that, we got a decent point at Wigan, Sunderland at home was showing some green shoots and to a certain extent KM's Wycombe victory was that too, as he had just stepped through the door. I think we have the personnel, that's what's frustrating. |
What you describe runs right through the club really and certainly in the stands. Admittedly we were crap on Saturday but the North Stand (and reflected throughout the ground I am sure) is packed full of people that think we should be rolling the likes of Gillingham over 4, 5, 6-0 playing free-flowing football. McKenna is 5 wins from 7 but from the chat in a couple of pubs I was in post game you wouldn't think it. I don't think it is unique to us either, Sunderland fans wanted Johnson bombed because they didn't like the football despite him sitting 3rd in the table.
We need to just get out of this division, it won't always be pretty but it needs to be effective. |  | | |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 12:00 - Feb 7 with 1598 views | blueasfook |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:58 - Feb 7 by Keno |
Next season we will finally get to board HMS P1ss the League!! |
Melford posts that every August on Facebook!
By end of September its clear we are not going to "p1ss the league" | |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 12:13 - Feb 7 with 1538 views | billlm |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 10:40 - Feb 7 by itfcjoe |
Morsy been a big miss, and whist he played at Bolton and we lost that was a fairly even game we just lost in the margins.
The reason we are nowhere now is because Cook failed to beat the rubbish teams this season as with that added we'd be there or thereabouts - but as you say it is mad how we have just consistently failed to beat the good teams - the only time we did was at the start of 19/20 and the short time Gill was running things......and what was happening then - direct, 2 strikers, more percentage football, higher pressing.......have we tried to be too clever? |
To tippy at the back in league one is to clever, at least have a more direct at times with two up top, I don't meen all the time like past seasons just catch the opposition off guard now and then, the other 23 teams no we just want to play through and around them so defending in numbers thwarts us, shake it up all I ask, And I agree your correct morsy big miss no control or drive in the middle apart from el miz just before God knows why we took him off at wednesday, and Bolton we shouldn't have lost, were hanging by a thread, as others rightly say the arrogant awful start, |  | | |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 12:30 - Feb 7 with 1493 views | SouperJim |
So from the last 7 games, we've gained ground on the 4 sides above us as follows:-
Oxford 4 points
Wycombe 5 points
Sheff Weds 3 points
Plymouth 5 points
We're 8 points off 6th, with 16 games remaining. So vague maths would say if we can maintain our current form we might just about sneak into 6th, presuming those 4 sides also maintain theirs (or go downhill). Also considering Oxford are the only ones who don't have at least 1 game in hand on us.
I don't think we could have realistically asked for too much more in terms of results than McKenna has given us. Failing to get a result at Sheff Weds was a big blow, as was losing Morsy for 4 games, but we do still have Oxford (away) and Plymouth (home) to come. But it's a really tough ask. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 12:49 - Feb 7 with 1457 views | thebooks |
There’s no way we’ll make the playoffs. Saturday was as poor as anything served up by Lambert and Cook — in fact, it was the typical performance of the last five years. We’ll lose against any decent teams. I predict we’ll finish 9th.
Actually, there is one improvement — the defence is better. I guess that’s why we’re just managing to edge past teams like Gillingham and Accrington.
I was fairly intrigued by the KM appointment, but now I’m back to thinking a Warnock figure would have been better. Our main problem is complacency, and I think we needed someone to take the team by the scruff of the neck.
I’m in no way anti-KM, incidentally, and obviously the whole point is to instill a better way of playing that puts us in good stead longer term. That’s different from getting a Cook or Lambert in to actually improve results quickly (and yes, I do realise our results under KM are actually good).
Of course, Warnock or similar may have been disastrous. |  | | |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 13:04 - Feb 7 with 1407 views | jayessess |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 12:49 - Feb 7 by thebooks |
There’s no way we’ll make the playoffs. Saturday was as poor as anything served up by Lambert and Cook — in fact, it was the typical performance of the last five years. We’ll lose against any decent teams. I predict we’ll finish 9th.
Actually, there is one improvement — the defence is better. I guess that’s why we’re just managing to edge past teams like Gillingham and Accrington.
I was fairly intrigued by the KM appointment, but now I’m back to thinking a Warnock figure would have been better. Our main problem is complacency, and I think we needed someone to take the team by the scruff of the neck.
I’m in no way anti-KM, incidentally, and obviously the whole point is to instill a better way of playing that puts us in good stead longer term. That’s different from getting a Cook or Lambert in to actually improve results quickly (and yes, I do realise our results under KM are actually good).
Of course, Warnock or similar may have been disastrous. |
So far McKenna's delivered exactly the things we'd have wanted from Warnock, hasn't he? Improved the defence, made us more resilient, got us organised, working hard, seen us grind out games, accumulated points rapidly regardless of performances.
I don't know why people always question motivation when we play badly. It's execution that's usually the problem, not desire. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 13:27 - Feb 7 with 1359 views | Steve_M |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 11:58 - Feb 7 by tractorboy1978 |
What you describe runs right through the club really and certainly in the stands. Admittedly we were crap on Saturday but the North Stand (and reflected throughout the ground I am sure) is packed full of people that think we should be rolling the likes of Gillingham over 4, 5, 6-0 playing free-flowing football. McKenna is 5 wins from 7 but from the chat in a couple of pubs I was in post game you wouldn't think it. I don't think it is unique to us either, Sunderland fans wanted Johnson bombed because they didn't like the football despite him sitting 3rd in the table.
We need to just get out of this division, it won't always be pretty but it needs to be effective. |
I did hear a couple of comments along the lines of "I can't see that he [McK] is any different" which is a bit odd.
Saturday was crap but far too many people got very angsty about it early on, screaming abuse at missed passes. No need to clap along but a little more patience would help. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 13:32 - Feb 7 with 1324 views | LankHenners |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 13:27 - Feb 7 by Steve_M |
I did hear a couple of comments along the lines of "I can't see that he [McK] is any different" which is a bit odd.
Saturday was crap but far too many people got very angsty about it early on, screaming abuse at missed passes. No need to clap along but a little more patience would help. |
Saturday was a banner day for the people behind me who get very agitated by short passing at the back and scream 'get it forwards!' and then let out a cry of 'who was that too?!' when a long ball is won by an opposition defender. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 13:40 - Feb 7 with 1292 views | tractorboy1978 |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 13:27 - Feb 7 by Steve_M |
I did hear a couple of comments along the lines of "I can't see that he [McK] is any different" which is a bit odd.
Saturday was crap but far too many people got very angsty about it early on, screaming abuse at missed passes. No need to clap along but a little more patience would help. |
I thought it was a really strange atmosphere. The players seemed a bit lethargic but so were the fans, it was very quiet and far more angst/moaning than encouragement.
A couple of people were chatting in the pub post game as the Oxford winner went in and it was 'new manager hasn't changed anything'. I think there is perhaps a bit of frustration we aren't any closer than we were when KMc came in, but that is out of his hands to a large extent. We can't be blaming him for the fact the teams above us seem pretty relentless. | | | |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 13:53 - Feb 7 with 1228 views | N2_Blue |
its bonkers those that thought Cook was sacked too early.
Even if he had improved things which he showed no signs of doing so we were miles off it as 5 wins in 7 has shown - still nowhere near.
Playoffs are unlikely and I think Wycombe MK and Sunderland are not catchable.
BUT not impossible and Oxford is the team to gun for.
Two aspects to view how this is done.
1 - BEAT them - We just have to beat them - no point beating about the bush, we can't beat them it's done.
2 SIX POINT DEFICIT - That means a 6 point deficit to make up in 15 other games - with good form very achievable i think. The form to do it will more than likely take us past any other team currently outside top 6
Of course if we win tomorrow and were somehow to beat MK on Saturday all sorts of possibilities open up but I still think its Oxford.
Anyway fail to pick up 3 points tomorrow its all but over. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 13:56 - Feb 7 with 1223 views | Swansea_Blue |
It's a huge gap when the teams about continue to pick up points. We'll need the rest of the season to have a chance of catching up, and it's only a slim chance. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 14:01 - Feb 7 with 1192 views | Churchman |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 12:49 - Feb 7 by thebooks |
There’s no way we’ll make the playoffs. Saturday was as poor as anything served up by Lambert and Cook — in fact, it was the typical performance of the last five years. We’ll lose against any decent teams. I predict we’ll finish 9th.
Actually, there is one improvement — the defence is better. I guess that’s why we’re just managing to edge past teams like Gillingham and Accrington.
I was fairly intrigued by the KM appointment, but now I’m back to thinking a Warnock figure would have been better. Our main problem is complacency, and I think we needed someone to take the team by the scruff of the neck.
I’m in no way anti-KM, incidentally, and obviously the whole point is to instill a better way of playing that puts us in good stead longer term. That’s different from getting a Cook or Lambert in to actually improve results quickly (and yes, I do realise our results under KM are actually good).
Of course, Warnock or similar may have been disastrous. |
You said ‘obviously the whole point is to instill a better way of playing that puts us in good stead longer term’ yet think aged Warnock is the man. It’s as short sighted in my view as the almost 100% support that Keane has amongst Sunderland supporters. I just don’t get this desire for ‘has beens’.
It’s noticeable the support for McKenna is already dribbling away, even after 5 wins in 7. Poor bloke. |  | | |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 14:03 - Feb 7 with 1179 views | textbackup |
As much as I want to believe we’ll get 5/6th as the weeks go by when we win, get get no closer, reality sets in a bit.
I won’t give up, but to finish this season in great form will stand us up nicely to kick on next season. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 14:06 - Feb 7 with 1160 views | jayessess |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 13:56 - Feb 7 by Swansea_Blue |
It's a huge gap when the teams about continue to pick up points. We'll need the rest of the season to have a chance of catching up, and it's only a slim chance. |
It's weird, the teams we were chasing, MK Dons and Oxford, have picked up the pace, whilst 2 of the teams who were out of reach, Sunderland and Wycombe, have dropped off. If everyone's current form roughly continues you'd be looking at MK Dons 3rd, Oxford 4th, Sheff Wed 5th, Then between us and Wycombe for 6th. | |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 14:17 - Feb 7 with 1108 views | BiGDonnie |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 12:49 - Feb 7 by thebooks |
There’s no way we’ll make the playoffs. Saturday was as poor as anything served up by Lambert and Cook — in fact, it was the typical performance of the last five years. We’ll lose against any decent teams. I predict we’ll finish 9th.
Actually, there is one improvement — the defence is better. I guess that’s why we’re just managing to edge past teams like Gillingham and Accrington.
I was fairly intrigued by the KM appointment, but now I’m back to thinking a Warnock figure would have been better. Our main problem is complacency, and I think we needed someone to take the team by the scruff of the neck.
I’m in no way anti-KM, incidentally, and obviously the whole point is to instill a better way of playing that puts us in good stead longer term. That’s different from getting a Cook or Lambert in to actually improve results quickly (and yes, I do realise our results under KM are actually good).
Of course, Warnock or similar may have been disastrous. |
Perhaps we should have signed a magician to immediately turn things around?
5/7 and still got people moaning like this FFS. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 14:22 - Feb 7 with 1099 views | FrimleyBlue |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 14:17 - Feb 7 by BiGDonnie |
Perhaps we should have signed a magician to immediately turn things around?
5/7 and still got people moaning like this FFS. |
Where's the moan from the poster?
He's happy we're winning games, but can see there's much more improvement needed in regards to performances.
Why is that such a drag for you and others and seen as a moan rather that being what it is, a desire to see better performances which may result it us being in a better position to win the important 'bigger' fixtures.. |  |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 14:27 - Feb 7 with 1086 views | BiGDonnie |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 14:22 - Feb 7 by FrimleyBlue |
Where's the moan from the poster?
He's happy we're winning games, but can see there's much more improvement needed in regards to performances.
Why is that such a drag for you and others and seen as a moan rather that being what it is, a desire to see better performances which may result it us being in a better position to win the important 'bigger' fixtures.. |
Re-read it thicko. | |
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| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 14:33 - Feb 7 with 1066 views | thebooks |
| 5 wins out of 7 now.... on 14:01 - Feb 7 by Churchman |
You said ‘obviously the whole point is to instill a better way of playing that puts us in good stead longer term’ yet think aged Warnock is the man. It’s as short sighted in my view as the almost 100% support that Keane has amongst Sunderland supporters. I just don’t get this desire for ‘has beens’.
It’s noticeable the support for McKenna is already dribbling away, even after 5 wins in 7. Poor bloke. |
I think the most important thing is promotion, and to that end maybe a Warnock-like appointment might have done the job. Might not have, of course; I’m probably just expressing some frustration at yet another dismal performance against a mediocre team in the third tier of football.
That doesn’t mean I’m against KM — after all, he has started better than the two apparently experienced, high quality appointments who preceded him.
What I’m saying is that the whole point of giving him the job is to instill that better, longterm style, when I think the priority should have been promotion at all costs. Maybe Warnock until the end of this season, then someone like KM.
You’re right that the enthusiasm has gone, but I think that’s mainly because the play-offs look very unlikely now. As others point out, even with 5 wins from 7, we’re still miles away — not much more results-wise KM could have done.
It’s a long end to the season from here if we play like we did on Saturday. | | | |
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