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Labour's plans for the trains. 17:03 - Dec 2 with 11155 viewsmonytowbray

✂️Cut rail fares by 33% from Jan 2020
👍Save the average commuter £1097/yr
✔️Fair fares for part-time workers
🎫Deliver a simple, London-style ticketing system nationwide
👛Free rail travel for under 16s

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/labour-rail-fares-cut-train

Backed, I think a 3rd off is fair for investment back if public owned. At the minute they charge double the cost of transporting commuters on a sh1te service to line the pockets of shareholders. Part time tickets have also needed to be a thing for far too long, as well as a simplier ticket/price structure.

I'd actually happily pay for trains knowing it was for the greater good of the nation.



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Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:14 - Dec 2 with 722 viewsblueconscience

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:12 - Dec 2 by Funge



That is correct. If people want more money/a better life, they should do something about it. Quite simple really.
[Post edited 2 Dec 2019 22:23]
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:19 - Dec 2 with 709 viewssparks

Of course, the main beneficiaries will be the people in commuter belt towns with expensive season tickets.

So we all get to pay for well to do people to get to their well paid London careers more cheaply...

Does anyone ever think any of this stuff through?

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Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:41 - Dec 2 with 676 viewslowhouseblue

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:19 - Dec 2 by sparks

Of course, the main beneficiaries will be the people in commuter belt towns with expensive season tickets.

So we all get to pay for well to do people to get to their well paid London careers more cheaply...

Does anyone ever think any of this stuff through?


i'm certain they've thought very carefully about which constituencies these people live in and how marginal those constituencies are.

that's 2 big bribes since their manifesto - pensions and season tickets.

And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show

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Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:41 - Dec 2 with 676 viewsButterbing

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:06 - Dec 2 by blueconscience

I have worked and studied hard to earn over the £80,000 threshold following my school failures due to serious illness.

I was working at a petrol station earning near minimum wage, when a customer pulled up in a supercar, it said on his fuel card he worked for Microsoft. I had a nice chat with him and he recommended a technology to learn and for the next 12 months between 1am and 4am when there were very few customers, I self taught what he recommended.

Thanks to him, I am now pretty successful and in constant demand. I didn’t do all that to be expected to pay more than others for people who have decided not to better themselves in some way or another.


so poor people are just lazier than you?
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:43 - Dec 2 with 666 viewsblueconscience

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:41 - Dec 2 by Butterbing

so poor people are just lazier than you?


A majority of people who want more money from the government, yes.
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:44 - Dec 2 with 661 viewsSwansea_Blue

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:43 - Dec 2 by blueconscience

A majority of people who want more money from the government, yes.


I’d stop there if I were you

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Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:47 - Dec 2 with 650 viewsButterbing

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:43 - Dec 2 by blueconscience

A majority of people who want more money from the government, yes.


Ok, this guy has got to be a wind up. Am i going to be whooshed?
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:48 - Dec 2 with 645 viewsSwansea_Blue

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:47 - Dec 2 by Butterbing

Ok, this guy has got to be a wind up. Am i going to be whooshed?


That’s true, could be sarcasm! I can’t tell these days.

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Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:52 - Dec 2 with 639 viewsTangledupin_Blue

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:06 - Dec 2 by blueconscience

I have worked and studied hard to earn over the £80,000 threshold following my school failures due to serious illness.

I was working at a petrol station earning near minimum wage, when a customer pulled up in a supercar, it said on his fuel card he worked for Microsoft. I had a nice chat with him and he recommended a technology to learn and for the next 12 months between 1am and 4am when there were very few customers, I self taught what he recommended.

Thanks to him, I am now pretty successful and in constant demand. I didn’t do all that to be expected to pay more than others for people who have decided not to better themselves in some way or another.


That is easily resolved.

Quit your present job and go back to the petrol station on minimum wage and you won't need to pay the higher tax rate.



You're welcome

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Labour's plans for the trains. on 23:05 - Dec 2 with 618 viewsEwan_Oozami

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:06 - Dec 2 by blueconscience

I have worked and studied hard to earn over the £80,000 threshold following my school failures due to serious illness.

I was working at a petrol station earning near minimum wage, when a customer pulled up in a supercar, it said on his fuel card he worked for Microsoft. I had a nice chat with him and he recommended a technology to learn and for the next 12 months between 1am and 4am when there were very few customers, I self taught what he recommended.

Thanks to him, I am now pretty successful and in constant demand. I didn’t do all that to be expected to pay more than others for people who have decided not to better themselves in some way or another.


This case is definitely intriguing me, Watson......

Am viewing TWTD in Table Mode on this browser so apologies if replying to a completely different post to the one I intended.
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 23:09 - Dec 2 with 608 viewsEwan_Oozami

Labour's plans for the trains. on 19:26 - Dec 2 by longtimefan

I suspect it will some nice stealth taxes such as removing the tax relief on pension contributions.


The sort of thing the Tories have been doing for years you mean?

Am viewing TWTD in Table Mode on this browser so apologies if replying to a completely different post to the one I intended.
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 23:13 - Dec 2 with 601 viewsButterbing

Labour's plans for the trains. on 23:09 - Dec 2 by Ewan_Oozami

The sort of thing the Tories have been doing for years you mean?


For example dividend tax, stamp duty increases, IR35 changes, removal of relief on mortgage interest etc. Stealth taxes have increased dramatically over the last few years.
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 23:53 - Dec 2 with 578 viewsTractorWood

Labour's plans for the trains. on 19:36 - Dec 2 by WeWereZombies

It's on the BBC website if you care to look:

8. Freeze train fares
The freeze would apply to all peak-time and season tickets for the next Parliament.

From: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50459123

Just after the climate crisis aware:

5. Tax frequent flyers
Those who take the most international flights face a tax rise, while costs would come down for people who take one or two international return flights a year.


I think international air fares are ridiculously cheap. You can fly to Singapore for £450 return. The Government are missing an open goal with taxing this more and it would help save the planet. International businesses that make decent cash would have to pay a bit more but it feels like common sense.

I like the idea of a decent rail network. The franchises are a shamble. That said, Network Rail is publicly owned and was responsible for the timetable horlicks a while back and I assume is the reason why crossrail now resides in stasis.

I think labour mean well but these policies don't feel properly costed. McDonnell said he wants to tax big tech firms but in reality Trump will just put in a counter tariff meaning we are back to square one.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-50636521
[Post edited 3 Dec 2019 0:01]

I know that was then, but it could be again..
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 06:30 - Dec 3 with 542 viewsStokieBlue

Labour's plans for the trains. on 23:53 - Dec 2 by TractorWood

I think international air fares are ridiculously cheap. You can fly to Singapore for £450 return. The Government are missing an open goal with taxing this more and it would help save the planet. International businesses that make decent cash would have to pay a bit more but it feels like common sense.

I like the idea of a decent rail network. The franchises are a shamble. That said, Network Rail is publicly owned and was responsible for the timetable horlicks a while back and I assume is the reason why crossrail now resides in stasis.

I think labour mean well but these policies don't feel properly costed. McDonnell said he wants to tax big tech firms but in reality Trump will just put in a counter tariff meaning we are back to square one.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-50636521
[Post edited 3 Dec 2019 0:01]


Certainly could increase air passenger duty but on the flight you've highlighted it's already 150 GBP for an economy flight (much more for higher classes). For comparison, it's 30 GBP regardless of class out of HK and 7.5% out of the US. Doesn't mean it couldn't be increased though.

Trump is considering a 100% tariff on French luxury imports in retaliation. A ridiculous idea given the tech companies certainly have a case up answer.

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Labour's plans for the trains. on 06:47 - Dec 3 with 525 viewsGaryCooper

Labour's plans for the trains. on 23:53 - Dec 2 by TractorWood

I think international air fares are ridiculously cheap. You can fly to Singapore for £450 return. The Government are missing an open goal with taxing this more and it would help save the planet. International businesses that make decent cash would have to pay a bit more but it feels like common sense.

I like the idea of a decent rail network. The franchises are a shamble. That said, Network Rail is publicly owned and was responsible for the timetable horlicks a while back and I assume is the reason why crossrail now resides in stasis.

I think labour mean well but these policies don't feel properly costed. McDonnell said he wants to tax big tech firms but in reality Trump will just put in a counter tariff meaning we are back to square one.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-50636521
[Post edited 3 Dec 2019 0:01]


Get two flights a year at the current rate, the next two say plus 20%, anything after that 200% more expensive, frequent flyers are polluting the world.
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 07:46 - Dec 3 with 510 viewsBlueBoots

Labour's plans for the trains. on 21:05 - Dec 2 by BloomBlue

But even if you tax those over £80k it's never going to be enough to pay for all these extra benefits, the only option is increase personal tax for everyone.
Which is why I want to know if Labour's train price decrease let's say saves me £100 if that means I'll have to pay an extra £120 in tax then pointless having the reduced fair.


I never said it would be enough to pay for "all these extra benefits" (Really? You call a decent Health Service, Police Force and Schools System "benefits"? These are all bedrocks of our society that have been neglected to almost breaking point over the past 10 years)

And increasing "personal tax for everyone" is not the only option - there are also the proposals such as the increase in Corporation Tax from 19% to 25% (and clamp down on the likes of Amazon who manage to avoid even paying the 19%) and reforms to Capital Gains Tax (which I mentioned on an earlier thread, but have copied and pasted to save time...)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/nov/05/thousands-of-uks-richest-people

According to the HMRC report linked in this article, 9,000 people made a combined total income of £33.7 billion from Capital Gains in the last financial year, on which they paid £5.1 billion in Capital Gains Tax. To put that into perspective, that's an average of over £400,000 per person who are only paying tax at a rate of 14.8%.
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 07:59 - Dec 3 with 497 viewsnoggin

Labour's plans for the trains. on 18:37 - Dec 2 by Marshalls_Mullet

People on above 80k pay a lot of tax as it stands. They should not be demonised.


How else do we get millions of people out of the poverty they currently live in?

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Labour's plans for the trains. on 08:02 - Dec 3 with 492 viewsBrixtonBlue

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:19 - Dec 2 by sparks

Of course, the main beneficiaries will be the people in commuter belt towns with expensive season tickets.

So we all get to pay for well to do people to get to their well paid London careers more cheaply...

Does anyone ever think any of this stuff through?


Every commuter is 'well to do' are they?

All train fares are way too expensive... that's even assuming you get a train and not a replacement bus.

Anyone who doesn't like this proposal is either not a frequent train user or mad.

I bet Bloots will downarrow this.
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 08:02 - Dec 3 with 492 viewsnoggin

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:43 - Dec 2 by blueconscience

A majority of people who want more money from the government, yes.


Wow.

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Labour's plans for the trains. on 08:03 - Dec 3 with 491 viewsBloomBlue

Labour's plans for the trains. on 07:46 - Dec 3 by BlueBoots

I never said it would be enough to pay for "all these extra benefits" (Really? You call a decent Health Service, Police Force and Schools System "benefits"? These are all bedrocks of our society that have been neglected to almost breaking point over the past 10 years)

And increasing "personal tax for everyone" is not the only option - there are also the proposals such as the increase in Corporation Tax from 19% to 25% (and clamp down on the likes of Amazon who manage to avoid even paying the 19%) and reforms to Capital Gains Tax (which I mentioned on an earlier thread, but have copied and pasted to save time...)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/nov/05/thousands-of-uks-richest-people

According to the HMRC report linked in this article, 9,000 people made a combined total income of £33.7 billion from Capital Gains in the last financial year, on which they paid £5.1 billion in Capital Gains Tax. To put that into perspective, that's an average of over £400,000 per person who are only paying tax at a rate of 14.8%.


But that's the problem, if they isnt enough money to pay for it will have to come from somewhere. I didnt say I wasnt prepared to pay for some things but this post is about the reduced train prices. My point is if I have to pay £120 increased personal tax to save £100 on my train ticket then no thanks keep the prices as is.
But as no one seems capable of telling us precisely how this benefit will be funded I'll have to go with my own conclusions
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 08:05 - Dec 3 with 487 viewsBrixtonBlue

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:14 - Dec 2 by blueconscience

That is correct. If people want more money/a better life, they should do something about it. Quite simple really.
[Post edited 2 Dec 2019 22:23]


Or be lucky enough to have a Microsoft employee turn up in a super car and tell them what to do.

I bet Bloots will downarrow this.
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 08:16 - Dec 3 with 477 viewsButterbing

Labour's plans for the trains. on 08:03 - Dec 3 by BloomBlue

But that's the problem, if they isnt enough money to pay for it will have to come from somewhere. I didnt say I wasnt prepared to pay for some things but this post is about the reduced train prices. My point is if I have to pay £120 increased personal tax to save £100 on my train ticket then no thanks keep the prices as is.
But as no one seems capable of telling us precisely how this benefit will be funded I'll have to go with my own conclusions


If they are nationalised then part of it will clearly be funded by not paying dividends to shareholders. It can also be funded by increased taxation elsewhere. Do we need to go through the whole “only the top 5% will pay more tax” thing again?
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Labour's plans for the trains. on 08:20 - Dec 3 with 472 viewsnoggin

Labour's plans for the trains. on 08:05 - Dec 3 by BrixtonBlue

Or be lucky enough to have a Microsoft employee turn up in a super car and tell them what to do.


He thinks everybody should be earning over 80k. We all just need to read a bit and we're all set.

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Labour's plans for the trains. on 08:35 - Dec 3 with 439 viewsBackToRussia

Labour's plans for the trains. on 22:14 - Dec 2 by blueconscience

That is correct. If people want more money/a better life, they should do something about it. Quite simple really.
[Post edited 2 Dec 2019 22:23]


https://www.theguardian.com/news/2019/dec/03/uk-six-richest-people-control-as-mu

Just wondered how this all fits into someone like yours' worldview.

The odds are so heavily stacked. And of course, systemically, these 13million people are NEEDED to STAY poor, doing grunt and menial jobs down the ladder that eventually creates wealth for these 6 rich slugs. If we all had high paying jobs, there would be a huge vacuum of labour needed. Really, all the Tories and right wingers' talk about aspirations is empty, they know that they need poor people to dig the trenches for them. In the end, it comes down to telling someone to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps.
[Post edited 3 Dec 2019 8:37]

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Labour's plans for the trains. on 08:37 - Dec 3 with 434 viewsRadlett_blue

If rail fares are reduced (and Britain does subsidise its railways by the lowest amount in Europe) the main beneficiaries will be commuters based in the South-East of England. Those who don't use the railways and use cars (drivers pay way above in fuel tax & car excise duty what is needed for our road network) won't necessarily be happy.
[Post edited 3 Dec 2019 8:41]
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