| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? 19:34 - Jan 20 with 36537 views | Dubtractor |
Obviously he is a bellend, but if anything defines privilege, it is that he was given a platform to perform on a national TV show when he has precisely nil musical talent. Nothing about his appearance is about talent, nothing whatsoever.
I should add, it is worth a listen to his performance to marvel at just how bad it is. It isn't even mediocre, its utterly awful.
https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/tv/video-lawrence-fox-performing-je [Post edited 20 Jan 2020 19:58]
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:21 - Jan 22 with 4772 views | jeera |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:05 - Jan 22 by gordon |
Are you saying that Danny Baker wasn't part of the press?? |
Quite.
Although not to jump on Lowhouse here, or to hijack the points made, but that comment and the follow up at the time does still show the underlying theme that is forever prevalent.
Consciously in a particular, vicious, targeted way, or in a more subtle, unconscious bias.
It's there all the time, in one way or another and will take more decades of educating and outbreeding until it's eradicated. If ever. |  |
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 19:23 - Jan 22 with 4766 views | eireblue |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 09:37 - Jan 22 by Oxford_Blue |
I just don’t agree with you.
In the context of disagreeing with someone’s point of view, why is it acceptable to argue that their race and gender are relevant?
If this had been said to a black, jeiwish or Islamic person, all hell would have broken loose. But it’s open season on safe targets like white men, especially if they are “privileged”. |
What precisely do she say, as evidenced by the transcript did she say, that was a negative or demeaning comment about Lawrence?
I believe she had said as much as “I am worried that as as WPM”.
At that point she was interrupted by Lawrence.
As Lawrence pointed out himself, he is a WPM.
He didn’t complain about the term, in the same way someone would complain about using the P word.
She wasn’t allowed to continue her point.
I believe you wanted some of reasoning and rational around this topic.
She was interrupted by a person that was white, male and in a position of privilege, as he tried to explain her point.
She is quite within her right as a female POC, to talk about why she may have concerns, and as a female POC, what may or may not be her worries, about this issue, which was about another harshly treated female POC.
She wasn’t allowed to expand on that view by a white, male in a position of privilege, he assumed what her point was going to be, and then decide to say he was bored of people talking about racism.
Again, the principle is a WPM doesn’t get to decide what a POC deems racist.
What is helpful is that minorities sometimes give people options on what is acceptable.
If you find the term white, privileged, male offensive, to reference a person in a position of privilege that is male and white,I will happily use a preferred term. |  | | |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:23 - Jan 22 with 4766 views | Herbivore |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:21 - Jan 22 by jeera |
Quite.
Although not to jump on Lowhouse here, or to hijack the points made, but that comment and the follow up at the time does still show the underlying theme that is forever prevalent.
Consciously in a particular, vicious, targeted way, or in a more subtle, unconscious bias.
It's there all the time, in one way or another and will take more decades of educating and outbreeding until it's eradicated. If ever. |
Sadly there's not much evidence that racial prejudice has gone away, or is even less prevalent than it was in the 60s: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/17/minority-ethnic-britons-face-shock |  |
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 19:25 - Jan 22 with 4763 views | Herbivore |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 19:23 - Jan 22 by eireblue |
What precisely do she say, as evidenced by the transcript did she say, that was a negative or demeaning comment about Lawrence?
I believe she had said as much as “I am worried that as as WPM”.
At that point she was interrupted by Lawrence.
As Lawrence pointed out himself, he is a WPM.
He didn’t complain about the term, in the same way someone would complain about using the P word.
She wasn’t allowed to continue her point.
I believe you wanted some of reasoning and rational around this topic.
She was interrupted by a person that was white, male and in a position of privilege, as he tried to explain her point.
She is quite within her right as a female POC, to talk about why she may have concerns, and as a female POC, what may or may not be her worries, about this issue, which was about another harshly treated female POC.
She wasn’t allowed to expand on that view by a white, male in a position of privilege, he assumed what her point was going to be, and then decide to say he was bored of people talking about racism.
Again, the principle is a WPM doesn’t get to decide what a POC deems racist.
What is helpful is that minorities sometimes give people options on what is acceptable.
If you find the term white, privileged, male offensive, to reference a person in a position of privilege that is male and white,I will happily use a preferred term. |
Nailed it. | |
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:33 - Jan 22 with 4742 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:18 - Jan 22 by Herbivore |
What evidence fit what hypothesis? I don't have a particular hypothesis, I'm just disagreeing with a bunch of white guys dismissing the possibility of racial prejudice in the press towards Meghan esepcially when people who have been on the receiving end of racial prejudice believe it to be the case. Clearly there looks to be a media bias against Meghan and I've not seen a good account of why on here as yet, just people parroting the press attack lines. |
The hypothesis appears to be that her treatment is based on latent racism....just saying. Imho I don't think it quite stacks up and couldn't say either way. Fwiw this Fox fella is a bit of a dick but isn't it amazing how him and his sister picked up their father's acting gene!! |  |
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:36 - Jan 22 with 4733 views | Herbivore |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:33 - Jan 22 by BanksterDebtSlave |
The hypothesis appears to be that her treatment is based on latent racism....just saying. Imho I don't think it quite stacks up and couldn't say either way. Fwiw this Fox fella is a bit of a dick but isn't it amazing how him and his sister picked up their father's acting gene!! |
Was their dad crap at acting as well then?
It is of course impossible to say for certain what is underlying the press's vilification of Meghan but I think when people of colour suggest they recognise it as being racial prejudice then it's a viee that shouldn't just be dismissed, esepcially by a bunch of people who haven't been on the receiving end of racial prejudice. [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 19:38]
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 19:38 - Jan 22 with 4724 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 19:25 - Jan 22 by Herbivore |
Nailed it. |
I agree that the argument between him and her on QT is an entirely different matter. | |
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:41 - Jan 22 with 4716 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:36 - Jan 22 by Herbivore |
Was their dad crap at acting as well then?
It is of course impossible to say for certain what is underlying the press's vilification of Meghan but I think when people of colour suggest they recognise it as being racial prejudice then it's a viee that shouldn't just be dismissed, esepcially by a bunch of people who haven't been on the receiving end of racial prejudice. [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 19:38]
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Nepotism is alive and well in the UK....just ignore the gumpf about meritocracy. | |
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:42 - Jan 22 with 4716 views | lowhouseblue |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:36 - Jan 22 by Herbivore |
Was their dad crap at acting as well then?
It is of course impossible to say for certain what is underlying the press's vilification of Meghan but I think when people of colour suggest they recognise it as being racial prejudice then it's a viee that shouldn't just be dismissed, esepcially by a bunch of people who haven't been on the receiving end of racial prejudice. [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 19:38]
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out of interest, and i am genuinely interested, when people of colour have made this assertion what justification have they provided? surely some explanation that can be understood by others as to what form it took must have been offered. any and all criticism of meghan can't be inherently racist can it? |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:47 - Jan 22 with 4704 views | gordon |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:42 - Jan 22 by lowhouseblue |
out of interest, and i am genuinely interested, when people of colour have made this assertion what justification have they provided? surely some explanation that can be understood by others as to what form it took must have been offered. any and all criticism of meghan can't be inherently racist can it? |
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ellievhall/meghan-markle-kate-middleton-dou
I think if you consistently see differences in the way different groups of people are treated in public life whether it be in sports, the arts, politics etc., then it's fair enough to call it out. |  | | |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:50 - Jan 22 with 4695 views | itfcjoe |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:02 - Jan 22 by eireblue |
Precisely.
Discrimination against a person, because of their nationality is racist.
How much of Harry’s personality do you actually have insight into, other than what is exposed via the media? |
So do you think people are saying the country is inherently racist because she is American, or because she is mixed race? |  |
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:57 - Jan 22 with 4683 views | lowhouseblue |
kate and meghan are objectively very different people. the press were pretty fawning to start with. but over time bits of the press clearly had it in for meghan and became very critical of her. but they may have good reasons for that - to do with her attitude, personality and actions. they came to see her as pushy, self-obsessed and entitled. that may be wrong and unfair but it has nothing to do with race. for a contrast compare meghan's press coverage with sarah ferguson's - she is white and was treated even worse than meghan. | |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 20:02 - Jan 22 with 4674 views | eireblue |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:50 - Jan 22 by itfcjoe |
So do you think people are saying the country is inherently racist because she is American, or because she is mixed race? |
Who has said that?
I have been mostly talking about Lawrence Fox.
I think as a WPMC* , I would be interested in, and respect the views of female POC.
I would consider their views and think about how I may need to adjust either conscious or unconscious bias.
I believe some people have said this before on TWTD, it is easy to get away with being derogatory about Americans, as an example.
At no time until it is eliminated, will discussing and getting rid of racism ever be boring.
* Celt by the way, although other terms have been used. | | | |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 20:04 - Jan 22 with 4668 views | eireblue |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:57 - Jan 22 by lowhouseblue |
kate and meghan are objectively very different people. the press were pretty fawning to start with. but over time bits of the press clearly had it in for meghan and became very critical of her. but they may have good reasons for that - to do with her attitude, personality and actions. they came to see her as pushy, self-obsessed and entitled. that may be wrong and unfair but it has nothing to do with race. for a contrast compare meghan's press coverage with sarah ferguson's - she is white and was treated even worse than meghan. |
I believe some female POC see some of what you described as invoking the angry black women trope. | | | |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 20:30 - Jan 22 with 4638 views | eireblue |
Hmmmm, starting to think he is a WMPC*
* the other C word. | | | |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 20:41 - Jan 22 with 4619 views | jeera |
"...the actor said racism should only be called out if it’s “obvious”."
Well, he's certainly making that a lot easier to do. | |
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 21:17 - Jan 22 with 4595 views | gordon |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:57 - Jan 22 by lowhouseblue |
kate and meghan are objectively very different people. the press were pretty fawning to start with. but over time bits of the press clearly had it in for meghan and became very critical of her. but they may have good reasons for that - to do with her attitude, personality and actions. they came to see her as pushy, self-obsessed and entitled. that may be wrong and unfair but it has nothing to do with race. for a contrast compare meghan's press coverage with sarah ferguson's - she is white and was treated even worse than meghan. |
What evidence do you have to support your assertion that 'it has nothing to do with race?' | | | |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 21:21 - Jan 22 with 4588 views | Enigma_Blue |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 19:18 - Jan 22 by Herbivore |
What evidence fit what hypothesis? I don't have a particular hypothesis, I'm just disagreeing with a bunch of white guys dismissing the possibility of racial prejudice in the press towards Meghan esepcially when people who have been on the receiving end of racial prejudice believe it to be the case. Clearly there looks to be a media bias against Meghan and I've not seen a good account of why on here as yet, just people parroting the press attack lines. |
'Disagreeing with a bunch white guys dismissing the possibility of racial prejudice in the press towards Meghan' Are you including me in this bunch of White guys?
Well I don't automatically subscribe to the fact that Meghan has been the victim of racial prejudice in the press so I must be a white guy, yeah?
There are as many PoC who don't believe that Meghan has been the victim of racial prejudice as there are those that do, me being one of them. Or is it the case that only the ones who do are the opinions that matter & all the rest should be ignored or dismissed?
I didn't read that link you sent me as I dont read MSM anymore as I prefer to use more impartial sources to get my information. Of course racism & prejudice still exist in this country unfortunately no one is saying it doesn't but this country is more tolerant now than it has ever been & as Laurence Fox said the most tolerant in the EU and I agree with him. [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 21:23]
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 21:25 - Jan 22 with 4580 views | jeera |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 21:21 - Jan 22 by Enigma_Blue |
'Disagreeing with a bunch white guys dismissing the possibility of racial prejudice in the press towards Meghan' Are you including me in this bunch of White guys?
Well I don't automatically subscribe to the fact that Meghan has been the victim of racial prejudice in the press so I must be a white guy, yeah?
There are as many PoC who don't believe that Meghan has been the victim of racial prejudice as there are those that do, me being one of them. Or is it the case that only the ones who do are the opinions that matter & all the rest should be ignored or dismissed?
I didn't read that link you sent me as I dont read MSM anymore as I prefer to use more impartial sources to get my information. Of course racism & prejudice still exist in this country unfortunately no one is saying it doesn't but this country is more tolerant now than it has ever been & as Laurence Fox said the most tolerant in the EU and I agree with him. [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 21:23]
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" I dont read MSM anymore as I prefer to use more impartial sources to get my information"
So selective info and not drawn from across the board then.
Surely it makes sense to take on board all information available, otherwise you're only feeding from those who may be duping you. | |
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 22:04 - Jan 22 with 4547 views | eireblue |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 21:21 - Jan 22 by Enigma_Blue |
'Disagreeing with a bunch white guys dismissing the possibility of racial prejudice in the press towards Meghan' Are you including me in this bunch of White guys?
Well I don't automatically subscribe to the fact that Meghan has been the victim of racial prejudice in the press so I must be a white guy, yeah?
There are as many PoC who don't believe that Meghan has been the victim of racial prejudice as there are those that do, me being one of them. Or is it the case that only the ones who do are the opinions that matter & all the rest should be ignored or dismissed?
I didn't read that link you sent me as I dont read MSM anymore as I prefer to use more impartial sources to get my information. Of course racism & prejudice still exist in this country unfortunately no one is saying it doesn't but this country is more tolerant now than it has ever been & as Laurence Fox said the most tolerant in the EU and I agree with him. [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 21:23]
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“Well I don't automatically subscribe to the fact that Meghan has been the victim of racial prejudice in the press.....
...I dont read MSM anymore as I prefer to use more impartial sources to get my information.”
So you wouldn’t actual know if the less impartial MSM has been racist, because you wouldn’t have read it.
Enigmatic, ....not so much [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 22:05]
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| (No subject) (n/t) on 22:14 - Jan 22 with 4536 views | Enigma_Blue |
| (No subject) (n/t) on 19:23 - Jan 22 by eireblue |
What precisely do she say, as evidenced by the transcript did she say, that was a negative or demeaning comment about Lawrence?
I believe she had said as much as “I am worried that as as WPM”.
At that point she was interrupted by Lawrence.
As Lawrence pointed out himself, he is a WPM.
He didn’t complain about the term, in the same way someone would complain about using the P word.
She wasn’t allowed to continue her point.
I believe you wanted some of reasoning and rational around this topic.
She was interrupted by a person that was white, male and in a position of privilege, as he tried to explain her point.
She is quite within her right as a female POC, to talk about why she may have concerns, and as a female POC, what may or may not be her worries, about this issue, which was about another harshly treated female POC.
She wasn’t allowed to expand on that view by a white, male in a position of privilege, he assumed what her point was going to be, and then decide to say he was bored of people talking about racism.
Again, the principle is a WPM doesn’t get to decide what a POC deems racist.
What is helpful is that minorities sometimes give people options on what is acceptable.
If you find the term white, privileged, male offensive, to reference a person in a position of privilege that is male and white,I will happily use a preferred term. |
She is entitled to her view but it is the way she said it that grates with me & a lot of other people.
'let's call this what it clearly & obviously is, it's racism ' like it is fact. Eh no it might be, it might not. Lawrence was no better stating 'it's not racism '
If she wanted to say 'in my opinion it i believe it is racism ' and then give her reason then fine. Then Laurence could give his.
What she said to Laurence about him was being a WPM was not really racist but the way the term gets bandied about so easily these days he probably is justified in saying that it was.
Why did she even need to mention that he is WPM, we can all see he is white & that he is a man, why did she need to make a point about it? Or is she providing audio description for the blind!
As for him being privileged why it was relevant to whatever she was going to say, only she will know. I mean Meghan is privileged, & was before she married Harry & is even more privileged now.
Oh and he didn't decide he was bored of racism. What he actually said was ' were the most tolerant & lovely country in Europe. It's so easy to throw the card of racism at everybody & it's getting really getting boring now.'
The race card is being thrown around too easily these days, what that does is cheapen & diminish it's meaning which will have a negative effect when calling ot racism that is blatant and obvious. [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 22:50]
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 22:21 - Jan 22 with 4519 views | Enigma_Blue |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 22:04 - Jan 22 by eireblue |
“Well I don't automatically subscribe to the fact that Meghan has been the victim of racial prejudice in the press.....
...I dont read MSM anymore as I prefer to use more impartial sources to get my information.”
So you wouldn’t actual know if the less impartial MSM has been racist, because you wouldn’t have read it.
Enigmatic, ....not so much [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 22:05]
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No because I have read enough MSM over the years to know that it is not impartial, & it is the reason I no longer watch terrestrial television. Fortunately more & more people are beginning to realise this, although not enough IMO. Maybe when more & people realise & stop paying their Tv licence we may one day get the impartial MS television we all deserve. [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 22:23]
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 22:26 - Jan 22 with 4511 views | jeera |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 22:21 - Jan 22 by Enigma_Blue |
No because I have read enough MSM over the years to know that it is not impartial, & it is the reason I no longer watch terrestrial television. Fortunately more & more people are beginning to realise this, although not enough IMO. Maybe when more & people realise & stop paying their Tv licence we may one day get the impartial MS television we all deserve. [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 22:23]
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That's absolute nonsense.
There's plenty of everyday news on msm that is perfectly accurate.
If I see a news report on BBC1 showing a robbery of a jewelers all captured on cctv, I'm not going to claim it's made up and staged.
"Today, Sainsburys put the price up of petrol at the pumps". I'm not going to scream it's a lie until I've studied another source.
When you watch this stuff you need to be specific otherwise you're just generalsing for the sake of it. | |
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| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 22:28 - Jan 22 with 4506 views | Enigma_Blue |
| Have we covered white privilege man Laurence Fox? on 22:04 - Jan 22 by eireblue |
“Well I don't automatically subscribe to the fact that Meghan has been the victim of racial prejudice in the press.....
...I dont read MSM anymore as I prefer to use more impartial sources to get my information.”
So you wouldn’t actual know if the less impartial MSM has been racist, because you wouldn’t have read it.
Enigmatic, ....not so much [Post edited 22 Jan 2020 22:05]
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You don't actually have to read or watch MSM to find out what has been portrayed by the MSM. There are independent sources that analyse & dissect what has been portrayed in the news. Thats the beauty of the internet these days. | | | |
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